How the Death Star battle was saved through editing

[AndyDursin]

I've seen no indication that George Lucas or anyone else put in a condition of sale that Disney never allow anyone to see the original versions of the Star Wars Trilogy. It looks to me that this is more of a fiscal thing with them - I don't believe they would want to issue the original versions as a separate release. The fans who want them are vocal, but the numbers simply aren't enough to justify a major expense by Disney. (It's not the massive number some fans think it to be.) I find it more likely that Disney will quietly have 2K scans done of the separation masters (if they haven't already done so) and they'll include those on a later edition as bonus features, much as Lucas did on the DVDs. These won't be huge restoration jobs - just 2K scans with whatever sound mix Disney wants to put on them, and they'll eventually be included in a big box set to get the fans to shell out yet again, now for all nine movies (so far).

I am simply speculating it's a condition of sale. I never said once there is evidence of it -- just my own personal thought because these corporations really don't want to not make money, and yet they are opting here not to exploit the market. I definitely disagree there isn't enough of an audience for these. Totally disagree. This is STAR WARS, a franchise that makes $600 million+ domestic on new installments that suck simply because of the brand name. This isn't a new Special Edition of BRIDESMAIDS (and I can't even count how many second and third releases we've gotten for movies that truly nobody cares about over the years). The fanbase is rabid and its mostly comprised of older fans who fork over handfuls for merchandise. They would absolutely buy proper releases of the theatrical versions if they were available -- and IMO they'd gladly spend 2X for a deluxe limited set if it came to that.

No matter what way you want to spin it, though, I think it's been a clearly intentional move on Lucas' part -- BEFORE Disney bought Lucasfilm -- not to circulate the original versions in a format anyone would want to watch. You don't need to spend a nickel to create a 16:9 version of those prints -- forget 2K restorations, just simple HD masters would have sufficed -- but Lucas wouldn't even do that, and released one of the worst 4:3 transfers in the history of the DVD format on the second run of those STAR WARS discs. I mean those are the same transfers that graced the laserdiscs -- ancient non-anamorphic 4:3. That was all before the Disney sale too, which is why I think he truly wants the Special Editions to be the only ones in circulation mostly.

Where I do agree is that Disney is cheap, and they don't care about catalog titles in general. They don't give a damn about their back catalog and pass off most of that content on Blu-Ray now as "Disney Movie Club exclusives" where they just recycle their streaming HD masters and add nothing else. That's why, as a consumer, you have to dislike the thought of Disney buying the Fox library because they are singularly the worst studio in terms of wanting to do anything with their back catalog. They don't release anything "to retail" physically unless its a new release or a milestone animated offering...the sheer thought of them taking over Fox's back library is really depressing to a hardcore movie buff, because they almost certainly will do nothing with it.

And in general, in terms of fan-edits and the like -- I agree there too. There's a whole market of fan-edits, not in terms of restoring movies and footage cut for whatever reason, but also versions of films that remove humor, or subplots, simply because some guy doesn't like it. I really don't care about "Kevin From Chicago"'s edit of JUSTICE LEAGUE for example. That said -- I don't put this in the same category, and people have shown more love for these films than Lucas has given them, frankly.

[KevinEK]

Andy, you’re correct that Lucas prefers not to have the original versions out now that he has his recuts. And as we noted, he made his preference clear in the way he made them available on the DVDs. I don’t think he was thumbing his nose at the fans when he did that - more that he prefers them the way he’s recut them and wishes everyone else felt the same. I remember the interviews with him when those DVDs came out, and his reaction to the complaints was bemusement, not contempt. I don’t think he was trying to sabotage them for the future - it’s just that he’s repeatedly made the wrong calls on that kind of thing, such as when he shot Episodes II and III on 1080p.

I do think we’ll see the original versions at some point from Disney - as I said, in a package where they think they can get the fans to pony up again. I disagree that there is a huge fan base waiting to buy the originals. That fanbase is there and it’s quite vocal, but the fans of the original versions are not anywhere near the size of the crowd that enjoys the latest Star Wars movies. We saw this in the disappointment original fans had with Last Jedi, while the younger crowd still ate it up. We’re now at a generational time when the 20-somethings and even the 30-somethings have a primary memory of Star Wars from the prequels or from the latest attempts. Disney knows they’ll make some money by including the original versions in a box set with the others, but they’re not looking to release those separately, as that would limit their sales to the older fans.

To do the work I believe they’ll arrange will cost more than a nickel but it will be reasonable. 2K scans of the seps, a quick color timing/damage check and a quick once over of the sound mix, hopefully in 5.1. That would at least keep the original versions presentable in an archival manner.

Finally, I do understand that the fans want to see the original versions any way they can - even if that means burning a copy of Team Negative One’s scan of a print. But I don’t think fans doing their own photoshop and color timing on these movies is particularly appropriate. They may love the movies, but they simply don’t know what they’re doing when they jump into the movies and start messing around. And Lucas would argue with both of us about how much love he’s shown to the films.

[AndyDursin]

We saw this in the disappointment original fans had with Last Jedi, while the younger crowd still ate it up.

Did they though? Just because people went to see it and bought tickets -- I mean, it's Star Wars -- doesnt mean they liked it necessarily. The drop was $300 million off THE FORCE AWAKENS domestically -- that's a massive fall, far more than whatever difference there was between STAR WARS and EMPIRE. It didn't play nearly into January and February as its predecessor did, a clear sign of bad worth of mouth. When you go to any place that tallies viewer responses about what audiences thought, the response was tepid. Is it only older people voting on Amazon or Rotten Tomatoes? Either way, if kids love Star Wars so much, and they're the ones buying the toys, why were sales down -- drastically? (Not my opinion -- a fact: https://www.cosmicbooknews.com/star-war ... sales-tank)

I just don't think there is this massive love for Star Wars amongst younger viewers. It's the older fans still powering the grosses -- people who are going to support these films, at least open them well, every time. That's why some kind of box-set would sell extremely well. To younger viewers, I don't think the love is there -- it's one of multiple "nostalgia franchises" they will go to, dragged to by their parents. I seriously don't believe there is a huge connection between kids and Star Wars today. Certainly not the connection audiences had with the Original Trilogy, it's not even comparable.

Disney will feed the machine so long as they don't devalue the brand -- and certain people will buy tickets to these mediocre milkings of the franchise no matter how lame they are -- but based on the drop between FORCE AWAKENS and LAST JEDI, and the fall-off theres going to be between ROGUE ONE and SOLO, I'd say they're well on the way to "de-specializing" Star Wars itself, all on their own.

[Eric Paddon]

I'll just say as my final word before my new discs arrive, one reason why I have felt the urge to go this route and get a good copy of the original trilogy is that increasingly I feel like what made it special to begin with is more and more cheapened not just by special editions but by this glut of SW movies and projects that have almost become an exercise in what years ago would have seemed like parodies becoming true. The idea of this many sequels and variant prequels etc. just after a while has the effect of making what made SW a classic of the cinema seem like something less. So in a way the more I see something of my youth cheapened, the more I feel like embracing the version I began with before it becomes forgotten forever.

[AndyDursin]

I feel like what made it special to begin with is more and more cheapened not just by special editions but by this glut of SW movies and projects that have almost become an exercise in what years ago would have seemed like parodies becoming true. The idea of this many sequels and variant prequels etc. just after a while has the effect of making what made SW a classic of the cinema seem like something less.

Absolutely Eric.

Disney's insatiable greed in pumping out these films -- release dates first and foremost in their minds, things like story and dramatic content far behind -- is a huge 180 from George Lucas himself. Say whatever we want about Lucas but he never felt the urge to exploit his series just for the sake of making more money -- and he well could have. He could have gone the route that Disney has and made a Star Wars movie a year until everyone was sick of it, but he chose to tell the stories he wanted and leave it at that.

Now we have 4 Star Wars movies in the space of 2.5 years, and already the drop-off has happened to the point where what STAR WARS as a brand when Disney purchased it isn't what it is now. And indeed, it never will be again.

[KevinEK]

There will come a point soon, or should, where Disney will need to seriously re-evaluate its plans here.
I would recommend not doing a new movie every single year, and I'd recommend a longer break time in between the various movies.
I'd also recommend scrapping the Riann Johnson trilogy before they dig themselves into a huge hole there.

The reason that Episode VII did incredible business is the pent-up demand and the open statement that they were going back to the basics of the original trilogy rather than the prequels. That, plus the knowledge that Harrison Ford and the others were back, helped make a lot of fans very happy to go to a new Star Wars movie. And it having been 10 years since Episode III helped. Since then, there's been the increasing drop-off, and I expect that to continue. There frankly just isn't enough story to sustain all these movies, and it doesn't look like Lucasfilm is generating much in the way of any new ideas.

The last time I saw this happen was with Star Trek in the 1990s - where Paramount wildly oversaturated the market with a constant situation of two TV series running plus new feature films every two years or so. By the time they realized they'd probably killed the golden goose, they were down to Enterprise and Nemesis, and the writing was on the wall. The hardest part about what happened there was that TNG actually did have a bunch of good episodes. There was just an increasingly diminishing level of returns from all the other series - and an increasing sense of repetition as the same tropes were used over and over again. The question now is at what point Disney pulls back on the reins.

[Eric Paddon]

I've been revisiting Marvel's comic adaptation of the original film. It took them six issues to do it, and in those days that was our ONLY way we could revisit the film afterwards along with the paperback. It's funny to see some of the things that Marvel added on their own like having Luke do a Jimmy Cagney impression after he sees Vader strike Ben down!

You Dirty Rat!.jpg (125.03 KiB) Viewed 1270 times

[AndyDursin]

[Monterey Jack]

FRAP!

[KevinEK]

The Marvel Star Wars comic actually had a bunch of good stories that it told in its day. Some were silly, but some were actually better than just the "filler story while we wait for the next movie" ideas you'd expect.
Between Empire and Jedi, there was a run for about a year where David Michelinie and Walt Simonson did great work.