INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

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Monterey Jack
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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#286 Post by Monterey Jack »

AndyDursin wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 10:24 am It's just so unbelievable that someone couldn't find a way to write out "Mutt" without adding this layer of sadness that not only wasn't needed, but doesn't belong with the material to begin with.
When Neve Campbell walked away from Scream 7 due to a salary dispute, they didn't kill her off off-screen, they just said that Sidney was living a happy life away from Ghostface killers. Of course, now that Spyglass fired Melissa Barrera over some stupid political sh!t on Twitter and Jenna Ortega walked away in solidarity, they just killed their own franchise entirely. :?
AndyDursin wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 10:24 am To a certain degree I'm disappointed in John Williams even scoring these Disney films and not working on something more meaningful. He's one of the only links of continuity between Lucas/Spielberg and the Disney company, but he owed no allegiance to the latter. I know he was paid well, but it's given these films some semblance of "class" or "connective tissue" they frankly didn't deserve. :evil:
Williams should have been doing more meaty dramas in the twilight of his illustrious film career, not essentially doing a "greatest hits" cut & paste job of his previous Star Wars and Indy scores for these wan retreads. :? I haven't absolutely LOVED a Williams score since War Horse, and that was a dozen years ago!

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#287 Post by AndyDursin »

Yeah, I hear ya. I haven't absolutely loved one since THE PATRIOT, and that was over 20 years ago!

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#288 Post by Monterey Jack »

Be like if WB cajoled Williams back to score the Fantastic Beasts movies. Sad to think the only reason he returned to the SW and Indy films was because Disney has (had! :oops: ) deeper pockets than WB, and Williams was a necessary "component" to recreate the formula of previous films. Does an almost 92-year-old man need the money that badly, especially being as wealthy as Williams must be after 50 years of scoring massive blockbusters? :? They may as well have hired Giacchino or somebody and given Williams a token "themes by" credit (which is what essentially his recent SW and Indy scores have been, just re-recorded cues from previous movies, only slower and more lethargic).

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#289 Post by AndyDursin »

Sad to think the only reason he returned to the SW and Indy films was because Disney has (had! :oops: ) deeper pockets than WB
It's a fair point. There were rumors of him coming back to score the end of the HP series, but it's clear from WB hiring someone like Nicholas Hooper that cost-savings were indeed a part of the later POTTER movies (remember when WB wanted to move the production of the last couple of films to, where, Germany? And the kids balked so much they kept it in England?).

With these later post-Lucas/Disney movies, there was nothing really to emotionally connect him there outside of the source material -- but now being made by mostly entirely different people and a studio he never had any connection with. As such, you know he got paid a fortune I'm sure for all of these projects. Musically it's been low-hanging fruit or whatever you want to call it, but admittedly, it's also enabled him to remain visible, do these world tours with top flight orchestras, record with Nutter and all of that. The cumulative impact of these scores he's written for Disney have, sad to say, added little/nothing to his creative legacy, but they've mostly been successful in keeping him active with those peripheral things he wants to do (and get paid handsomely of course in the process).

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Paul MacLean
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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#290 Post by Paul MacLean »

AndyDursin wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 2:01 pm The cumulative impact of these scores he's written for Disney have, sad to say, added little/nothing to his creative legacy, but they've mostly been successful in keeping him active with those peripheral things he wants to do (and get paid handsomely of course in the process).
I still feel those Star Wars scores have their moments -- certainly they are more interesting than The Post or BFG!

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#291 Post by AndyDursin »

Just for the record -- Mangold is now backpadeling on his lies that attacked Doomcock and others, discussing now in some detail all the endings that either were shot or talked about. And all of them are what Doomcock spent years reporting on.

Mangold is still hedging his bets saying some things were never filmed, but nobody believes it, especially not when JOHN WILLIAMS HIMSELF CONFIRMED SCORING THE NEW ENDING a year ago.

So, in short -- Doomcock was right again. He's taking a victory lap -- as well he should.


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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#292 Post by Monterey Jack »

You would have to be CRAZY to think that the limp-dick ending we got was what was originally intended. Rarely have I seen a movie with an ending that was so obviously reshot, and with obviously no money to come up with another actual action climax, so they just had Indy get punched out and wake up in bed after the escape back into the present! :roll:

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#293 Post by mkaroly »

Paul MacLean wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 3:48 pm
AndyDursin wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 2:01 pm The cumulative impact of these scores he's written for Disney have, sad to say, added little/nothing to his creative legacy, but they've mostly been successful in keeping him active with those peripheral things he wants to do (and get paid handsomely of course in the process).
I still feel those Star Wars scores have their moments -- certainly they are more interesting than The Post or BFG!
Agreed Paul.

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#294 Post by Edmund Kattak »

mkaroly wrote: Sun Dec 10, 2023 9:46 am
Paul MacLean wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 3:48 pm
AndyDursin wrote: Fri Dec 01, 2023 2:01 pm The cumulative impact of these scores he's written for Disney have, sad to say, added little/nothing to his creative legacy, but they've mostly been successful in keeping him active with those peripheral things he wants to do (and get paid handsomely of course in the process).
I still feel those Star Wars scores have their moments -- certainly they are more interesting than The Post or BFG!
Agreed Paul.
I also agree. At least the new thematic material in those SW scores seemed cohesive. After listening to the isolated score on "Destiny," you can tell where the music seemed at least "new" but was surrounded by a pastiche of old Indy musical ideas, a cue that sounds influenced by "Spyders" from MINORITY REPORT, and a quote of an idea from (of all movies), 1941!

As much I can't stand the Disney SW movies, at least there's some overall flow to the music. Dial of Destiny has no overall cohesive flow to complement the narrative.
Indeed,
Ed

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#295 Post by mkaroly »

I have listened to DoD only once...nothing really stuck out to me. It has a modern feel to it musically, but it is just kind of "there".

In contrast, I do think the recent SW scores have themes and an overall flow (I agree with you Ed) - I admit that I really like Rey's theme (wish her character on film was decent though). I would love to have complete score presentations of those newer films, but there is no way those will ever get released so I am stuck with what I have.

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#296 Post by Monterey Jack »

People giving me crap about being "factually wrong" about the Dial Of Destiny reshoots on Twitter. :roll: It's been almost a year, the movie bombed, they can 'fess up already!

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#297 Post by AndyDursin »

That movie was so obviously tinkered with, how can anyone think logically the script was ever written out that way and reshoots weren't involved.

In other news, what a misfire it was not to include Quan in the movie. Have him as the sidekick instead of Fleabag and/or dump Sallah (did anyone even care he was in the film?).

They had their chance and must be kicking themselves after seeing something like this!


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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#298 Post by Monterey Jack »

I'm happy as hell that Quan's making a legit return to acting. :) Having him and Indy on a new adventure would have been so much better than seeing a gaunt, frail-looking John Rhys-Davies being reduced to Indy's Uber driver. :(

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#299 Post by AndyDursin »

It was the perfect way to bring him back into the franchise -- and he's not elderly either! Kennedy and Disney fail, as usual...

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Re: INDIANA JONES & THE DIAL OF DESTINY To Rival "John Carter" As Disney's Biggest Bomb

#300 Post by Monterey Jack »

AndyDursin wrote: Mon Mar 18, 2024 1:44 pm It was the perfect way to bring him back into the franchise -- and he's not elderly either!
Dude's fifty, but still looks like he's thirty-five (and he's still physically spry).

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