Monterey Jack wrote:
What happened with Eastwood's taste in music? In the 60s and 70s we had a rotating shift of Fielding, Ennio Morricone and Lalo Schifrin on most Eastwood flicks, but move into the 80s and 90's and it's all mostly Lennie Niehaus and Eastwood himself, using the same rinky-tink piano noodling and boring horn motifs.
Morricone was certainly Leone's choice, tho Schifrin and Fielding were probably Eastwood's, both having extensive jazz backgrounds..
I think Eastwood went with Niehaus because Niehaus had been Fielding's orchestrator (along with Grieg McRitchie). In fact, according to Niehaus, Fielding was a slow writer and many of his scores were co-written by Niehaus.
But I agree, I wish many of the scores for Eastwood's films were better. Of course, in my opinion that includes the ones scored by Fielding!
Second viewing of "Cloverfield" for me last night. I have to admit, I'm getting more drawn to this film because it's offbeat approach is almost literally the only way to do this kind of film. I picked up a few more details this time out and did anyone notice how they have a subliminal cut of one frame of "King Kong" after the helicopter crash??
"Kiss Them For Me". A very uneven Cary Grant comedy from 1957 with him as a navy war hero trying to live it up on his brief shore leave in San Francisco. A lot of TV names pop in and out in amusing bit parts, and it's *really* weird to see Werner Klemperer, Colonel Klink himself as an American naval officer.
Jayne Mansfield has a supporting part doing her patented routine to amusing effect. But it's really sad to see how this film tried too hard to make Suzy Parker, then America's top fashion model and the first true "supermodel" there ever was, an instant film star. Suzy looks great, knows how to strike a pose and from time to time shows some elegant charm (and in one great scene some dry wit too), but the problem is the film demands too much of her with some heavily dramatic moments between her and Cary and she's just not up to it. Suzy should have been brought in gradually to movies with small roles highlighting her natural ability and giving her time to work on other areas. And then after this they made matters worse with her melodramatic turn in "The Best Of Everything" that brought her time as an A-picture performer to an end.
"Island In The Sky" (1953). If they remade this film today you know very well that we'd never see John Wayne's character feel the need to recite the Lord's Prayer.
Since Paramount is for the moment no longer providing many websites with review product I waited to snag a copy of BRAVEHEART on Blu Ray.
Man I had forgotten how outstanding a film this is. Assured, intelligent, filled with well drawn characters, gorgeous visuals, one of Horner's finest scores...just a knockout movie. Perhaps even better than I recall.
AndyDursin wrote:Since Paramount is for the moment no longer providing many websites with review product I waited to snag a copy of BRAVEHEART on Blu Ray.
Man I had forgotten how outstanding a film this is. Assured, intelligent, filled with well drawn characters, gorgeous visuals, one of Horner's finest scores...just a knockout movie. Perhaps even better than I recall.
I guess I really do have to get a Blu-ray player now that this out. I saw Braveheart three times upon its initial release, and its portrayal of heroism, romance and self-sacrifice is among the most stirring ever put on screen, as is its visceral depiction of the horror of medieval warfare. Certainly it is Gibson's finest performance, and agreed, one of Horner's best scores. I'm definitely due to re-visit to this one.
I know a number of people dismissed Braveheart as something of a poor man's Spartacus, and while Gibson's film certainly bears some influence of epics like Spartacus and El Cid, Braveheart is certainly as great a film.
Paul MacLean wrote:I know a number of people dismissed Braveheart as something of a poor man's Spartacus, and while Gibson's film certainly bears some influence of epics like Spartacus and El Cid, Braveheart is certainly as great a film.
The Blu-Ray is just superb. I saw it theatrically (in mono, and as I recall, I had to keep telling the projectionist to keep the frame in line!), and the BD blows away what I saw in theaters back in '96 (before they redid that complex so everything was in stereo and, more recently, digitally projected).
Paul MacLean wrote:I know a number of people dismissed Braveheart as something of a poor man's Spartacus, and while Gibson's film certainly bears some influence of epics like Spartacus and El Cid, Braveheart is certainly as great a film.
The Blu-Ray is just superb. I saw it theatrically (in mono, and as I recall, I had to keep telling the projectionist to keep the frame in line!), and the BD blows away what I saw in theaters back in '96 (before they redid that complex so everything was in stereo and, more recently, digitally projected).
LEGEND (1985) - 5-6/10. The visuals are gorgeous, and it looks very operatic (love the wraith/seduction ballet scene) and with Goldsmith's score comes across as something magical...but I just couldn't get into the dialogue, acting, and Tom Cruise. I did not see the version with Tangerine Dream's score, so I can't comment on it. I imagine I'd not like it too much because it was added to hte film AFTER Goldsmith had already tailored his music to the visuals. It gets 10/10 for visuals and overall look.
mkaroly wrote:LEGEND (1985) - 5-6/10. The visuals are gorgeous, and it looks very operatic (love the wraith/seduction ballet scene) and with Goldsmith's score comes across as something magical...but I just couldn't get into the dialogue, acting, and Tom Cruise.
I think it is a wonderful film, but I wish that the script had had more to say, rather than being just a pastiche of fairy tale elements. Still, the film evokes a powerful atmosphere, both visually and aurally (much as did Blade Runner).
Cruise never really bothered me. He was cast well-before Top Gun made him a megastar (Legend's American release was held-up for nearly a year) but once he became known as "Maverick" it was harder to buy him in the role.
I did not see the version with Tangerine Dream's score, so I can't comment on it.
The Tangerine Dream version opens with a corny title crawl which talks about the Lord of Darkness' banishment, and "Jack, who lives among the animals of the forest", and how "A beautiful girl named Lili loves Jack with all her heart...".
In the beginning of the film Tim Curry speaks a different (and to my mind better) monolog which is more "poetic" and less literal. We also see his character in the opening scene -- but he is bathed in ultraviolet light and his fingernails are painted florescent yellow! The opening conversation between Tim Curry and the goblin is also shorter.
The TD version includes a "make out" scene, shortly after Cruise and Sara meet in the forest (which was constructed from unused angles of their kiss at the end of the film).
The TD version also omits some key shots from the first unicorn scene, including Mia Sara smiling defiantly at Cruise as she dismisses his pleas to leave them alone. It also omits the unicorn's charge toward her, and of course the Goldsmith song she sings to lure it to her.
The scene between Cruise and the swamp hag runs less than a minute in the American version (but is longer in the Euro cut, though not as long as in the director's cut).
All dialog references to Mia Sara being a princess are either cut or re-dubbed.
The scene where Cruise first meets the fairies is also much shorter, as are the dialog scenes between Sara and Tim Curry.
The final scenes are very different in the US version, depicting Cruise and Sara running off into the sunrise together (instead of Cruise doing so alone).
The final scenes are edited into something of a music video, as a Jon Anderson song accompanies Cruise retrieving the ring and reviving Sara, intercut with shots (not seen in the directors cut) of the unicorn being revived. The last scene dissolves to a shot of Tim Curry laughing diabolically before fading out.
A laughable pop song, "Is Your Love Strong Enough", sung by Bryan Ferry plays over the end credits (it was not composed by Tangerine Dream though). There was a hilarious music video of this song which ran on MTV at the time of the film's release (and was included on the Ultimate Edition DVD).
Tangerine Dream's music is terrible. Well, its inoffensive on its own I suppose, but its 80s synth-pop style is completely ill-suited the film, and embarrassingly dated.
The songs, the synth-pop score, the make-out scene were all a clear attempt to cater to the John Hughes audience. I'm forever astonished that Universal could think that a movie like Legend could actually be converted into some kind of teen angst movie.
Legend is ghastly, easilly the worst movie Ridley Scott ever made (yes, worse than Hannibal! ). It's like the fantasy doodles on a nine-year-old girl's school notebook come to garish, mid-80's MTV life, and it's unbearable. Goldsmith's score is the only good thing to come out of that debacle, and even tat isn't as good as Jerry's other fantasy scores of the period (The Secret Of NIMH, both film and score, wipes the floor with it)
Monterey Jack wrote:Legend is ghastly, easilly the worst movie Ridley Scott ever made (yes, worse than Hannibal! ).
Nope. Body of Lies takes that honor, with A Good Year and Someone to Watch Over Me not far behind. (I've yet to see Hanibal.)
It's like the fantasy doodles on a nine-year-old girl's school notebook come to garish, mid-80's MTV life, and it's unbearable.
I can understand if people find the script slim and Cruise miscast, but, Legend is paragon of visual artistry. That movie is one of the most imaginatively designed and photographed films of all time -- and far-reaching in its influence. And could you qualify the MTV reference?
Goldsmith's score is the only good thing to come out of that debacle, and even tat isn't as good as Jerry's other fantasy scores of the period (The Secret Of NIMH, both film and score, wipes the floor with it)
Well, Legend is to my ears a far-more impressive, dramatic -- and inspired -- score than The Secret of NIMH. I like Secret of NIMH just fine, but it isn't in league with Legend. There are similarities with NIMH -- the etherial chorus, the songs and general "fairy tale" tone, but Legend is more multi-layered, with a more dramatic boldness, and delves into shadow realms where the lighter, more childlike NIMH simply doesn't tread. That makes it, to me, the more interesting score. In a way it married NIMH's childlike tone to the air of creeping evil found in The Final Conflict.
Apart from that, rarely, if ever, did Goldsmith have opportunity to write so broadly, and lyrically. NIMH's fast-paced animation effectively curtailed such long lines. Beyond that he displays impeccable, classical artistry in the score. Legend is classy, and several of his finest cues of all time are to be heard in Legend -- "The Dress Waltz", "The Unicorns", "The Ring" among them.
As for the film, it isn't perfect and I suppose its not to everyone's taste...but I still find it more entertaining (and certainly no more miscast) than the Lord of the Rings movies.
Last edited by Paul MacLean on Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:46 am, edited 5 times in total.
Monterey Jack wrote:Legend is ghastly, easilly the worst movie Ridley Scott ever made (yes, worse than Hannibal! ). It's like the fantasy doodles on a nine-year-old girl's school notebook come to garish, mid-80's MTV life, and it's unbearable. Goldsmith's score is the only good thing to come out of that debacle, and even tat isn't as good as Jerry's other fantasy scores of the period (The Secret Of NIMH, both film and score, wipes the floor with it)
This is all taste here, but it's funny, because LEGEND seems to inspire a wide range of opinions. The mullet-haired guy who used to run the local laserdisc store only liked the U.S. version with Tangerine Dream's music -- so much that he hated the Japanese LD he routinely rented out that Goldsmith's music in it!
For me, on this one, I could not disagree more. I'm a big fan of LEGEND visually -- no, the story does not hold up, Mia Sara is limp and the script seemed like it needed another rewrite or two (or three), but the cinematography and art direction alone are enough to bring me back for repeat viewing. The way the film looks and its atmosphere are mind-blowing to me -- it's everything Peter Jackson's LOTR CGI fests want to be visually (I'm just talking about the design here, not the narratives), but Scott's world seems more lived in, organic and "real."
Musically I rank Goldsmith's score with his finest works, bar none -- and I find it to be a far more compelling work than SECRET OF NIMH thematically and stylistically. The textures, the themes, the use of chorus and vocals -- I think it "wipes the floor" with NIMH myself. It's a far more developed and interesting thematic work on every level (and a different kind of score, since NIMH is just a straightforward children's fantasy adventure and doesn't have much complexity to it by comparison). In fact it's one of my all-time favorite soundtracks, period, so in my mind there's no real comparison between the two. But, as they say, different strokes for different folks.
As far as where LEGEND sits in Scott's filmography I can name a handful or more of his movies that aren't nearly as good. And HANNIBAL is unquestionably one of the worst movies I've ever paid to see, or be forced to sit through. Utter, unredeeming garbage of the lowest kind, and a film Scott should be ashamed of.
