John Johnson wrote:

Monterey Jack wrote:(although it's maddening to realize how much of Horner's score was recycled for pretty much EVERY film he's done since

I would rather listen to Horner from the 80s, than some of the scores that are being churned out today.

I think most anyone, even Horner haters, would almost agree with that. Or else they need their ears cleaned out, lol.

AndyDursin wrote:

John Johnson wrote:

Monterey Jack wrote:(although it's maddening to realize how much of Horner's score was recycled for pretty much EVERY film he's done since

I would rather listen to Horner from the 80s, than some of the scores that are being churned out today.

I think most anyone, even Horner haters, would almost agree with that. Or else they need their ears cleaned out, lol.

Oh, I agree that Horner's early-80's output had a certain vibrancy that's sorely lacking from his recent output, but...Goddammit, he was using that "Dan-Ger Mo-TIIIIIIFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" crap as early as 1983?! That's what's so aggrivating about Horner...even his good scores get sullied when you hear an earlier effort with whole music cues that were recycled almost VERBATIM in later scores. I saw Wolfen for the first time last year, and all I kept thinking throughout the entire thing was "ALIENS! WRATH OF KHAN! ALIENS! WRATH OF KHAN!" I guess it all boils down to where you first heard the half-dozen themes and/or motifs that Horner has leaned on incessantly for the last 30 years. Sneakers is kind of ruined now thanks to Brainstorm, and that used to be one of my favorite Horner scores.

It's true, WOLFEN, TREK II, ALIENS, BRAINSTORM -- all cut from a certain cloth. And not only that, but I look at those early Horner scores as kind of his "bible" for future scores that reused the exact same motifs.

I think BATTLE BEYOND THE STARS and HUMANOIDS FROM THE DEEP ought to be lumped in there too...the "origins" for Horner's blueprints, as it were.

[/quote]

That's what's so aggrivating about Horner...even his good scores get I saw Wolfen for the first time last year, and all I kept thinking throughout the entire thing was "ALIENS! WRATH OF KHAN! ALIENS! WRATH OF KHAN!" I guess it all boils down to where you first heard the half-dozen themes and/or motifs that Horner has leaned on incessantly for the last 30 years. Sneakers is kind of ruined now thanks to Brainstorm, and that used to be one of my favorite Horner scores. [/quote]

Surely, that should be the other way round. Watching Aliens, Wrath of Khan and all I could think of, was Wolfen. LOL

I'd love to see the myriad of different cuts of WOLFEN one day...since there were so many, some of which completely changed the meaning of the movie as memory serves. A very interesting, not completely satisfying film with intriguing elements in it.

The trailer has some scenes that weren't used in the movie too.

John Johnson wrote:Surely, that should be the other way round. Watching Aliens, Wrath of Khan and all I could think of, was Wolfen. LOL

That's what I'm getting at...Horner re-uses so many cues and themes VERBATIM from film to film that whatever movie you hear them in first will stick in your mind, even if he used them in an earlier movie. Had I seen Wolfen first, I would have been thinking "WOLFEN!" all through Wrath Of Khan and Aliens. Reminds me of a joke I read in FSM years ago:

Q: Why is it pointless to tell a James Horner joke?

A: Because you're probably heard it before.

I remember seeing Wolfen at one point as an adult but I honestly don't remember the music. Wasn't Horner's score for Wolfen a replacement score for someone else, whose contribution got rejected?

mkaroly wrote:I remember seeing Wolfen at one point as an adult but I honestly don't remember the music. Wasn't Horner's score for Wolfen a replacement score for someone else, whose contribution got rejected?

Yeah, Craig Safan had scored it -- Intrada ended up producing a promo of that score, which is more "dissonant" and doesn't have any theme.

AndyDursin wrote:

mkaroly wrote:I remember seeing Wolfen at one point as an adult but I honestly don't remember the music. Wasn't Horner's score for Wolfen a replacement score for someone else, whose contribution got rejected?

Yeah, Craig Safan had scored it -- Intrada ended up producing a promo of that score, which is more "dissonant" and doesn't have any theme.

Whatever happened to Craig Safan? He showed some promise.

John Johnson wrote:

AndyDursin wrote:

mkaroly wrote:I remember seeing Wolfen at one point as an adult but I honestly don't remember the music. Wasn't Horner's score for Wolfen a replacement score for someone else, whose contribution got rejected?

Yeah, Craig Safan had scored it -- Intrada ended up producing a promo of that score, which is more "dissonant" and doesn't have any theme.

Whatever happened to Craig Safan? He showed some promise.

I think some composers only have a few truly inspired works in them. After LAST STARFIGHTER and REMO WILLIAMS that was pretty much it for Safan. You look at Cliff Eidelman, he had his CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS THE DISCOVERY (I do consider that an excellent score) and then that was it. Even Basil Poledouris wrote some phenomenal scores in the '80s but seemed like his inspiration ran out at a certain point as the decade wore on.

It's sort of like guys who write Broadway musicals -- often times, they put it together for a couple of projects that hit the mark, but then fail to recapture that magic afterwards. They keep working, but it's never the same. Some movie composers follow that path.

AndyDursin wrote:

John Johnson wrote:

AndyDursin wrote: Yeah, Craig Safan had scored it -- Intrada ended up producing a promo of that score, which is more "dissonant" and doesn't have any theme.

Whatever happened to Craig Safan? He showed some promise.

I think some composers only have a few truly inspired works in them. After LAST STARFIGHTER and REMO WILLIAMS that was pretty much it for Safan. You look at Cliff Eidelman, he had his CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS THE DISCOVERY (I do consider that an excellent score) and then that was it. Even Basil Poledouris wrote some phenomenal scores in the '80s but seemed like his inspiration ran out at a certain point as the decade wore on.

It's sort of like guys who write Broadway musicals -- often times, they put it together for a couple of projects that hit the mark, but then fail to recapture that magic afterwards. They keep working, but it's never the same. Some movie composers follow that path.

Two words.

John Scott. Sadly underused.

John Johnson wrote:
Two words.

John Scott. Sadly underused.

One word: AMEN!


Safan, Folk, Broughton, Rosenthal...all kinds of excellent composers like these that have disappeared for one reason or another.

John Johnson wrote:

AndyDursin wrote:

John Johnson wrote: Whatever happened to Craig Safan? He showed some promise.

I think some composers only have a few truly inspired works in them. After LAST STARFIGHTER and REMO WILLIAMS that was pretty much it for Safan. You look at Cliff Eidelman, he had his CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS THE DISCOVERY (I do consider that an excellent score) and then that was it. Even Basil Poledouris wrote some phenomenal scores in the '80s but seemed like his inspiration ran out at a certain point as the decade wore on.

It's sort of like guys who write Broadway musicals -- often times, they put it together for a couple of projects that hit the mark, but then fail to recapture that magic afterwards. They keep working, but it's never the same. Some movie composers follow that path.

Two words.

John Scott. Sadly underused.

I agree with that! Funny how his name came up.... lol.

AndyDursin wrote:

John Johnson wrote:

AndyDursin wrote: I think some composers only have a few truly inspired works in them. After LAST STARFIGHTER and REMO WILLIAMS that was pretty much it for Safan. You look at Cliff Eidelman, he had his CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS THE DISCOVERY (I do consider that an excellent score) and then that was it. Even Basil Poledouris wrote some phenomenal scores in the '80s but seemed like his inspiration ran out at a certain point as the decade wore on.

It's sort of like guys who write Broadway musicals -- often times, they put it together for a couple of projects that hit the mark, but then fail to recapture that magic afterwards. They keep working, but it's never the same. Some movie composers follow that path.

Two words.

John Scott. Sadly underused.

I agree with that! Funny how his name came up.... lol.

One of the nicest composers you could ever hope to meet.

John Johnson wrote:

AndyDursin wrote:

John Johnson wrote: Two words.

John Scott. Sadly underused.

I agree with that! Funny how his name came up.... lol.

One of the nicest composers you could ever hope to meet.

I know. I've recently become aware