SUPERMAN II Donner Cut: Has Arrived!!

[AndyDursin]

Just got it -- and the review is up!

http://www.andyfilm.com/11-15-06.html

[Neil S. Bulk]

Did you get any of the other discs? I just read at Superman Cinema that someone got the set in R3 and the original cut of Superman - The Movie does not have the original 1978 mix. If that is the case, that's a deal breaker for me.

Neil

[AndyDursin]

Sadly no...I'll probably have to order it like everyone else.

So far no great shakes...there's now 12 minutes of recap until the opening credits finish...then a cute scene where Lois tries to prove Clark isn't Superman by jumping out the Daily Planet, though right now I prefer what Lester shot in Niagara Falls instead to that scene...and now we're into the longer introduction to Lex Luthor in prison (same scene as the ABC version) and the villains in space footage (pretty much exactly the same as before with Williams' original music instead of Thorne's).

[Neil S. Bulk]

So far no great shakes...

Wait until you get to the re-powering scene.

(you'll get that when you see it)

Neil

[AndyDursin]

So far no great shakes...

Wait until you get to the re-powering scene.

(you'll get that when you see it)

Neil

OK that scene was great -- easily the best addition to this cut.

Otherwise, the rest of this does not function dramatically at all. Between the jarring shifts in tone and version to the music (I will say it -- Ken Thorne's music might have been poorly performed but it functioned better than tracking Williams' original score), I just did not find this to be a cohesive movie experience whatsoever.

The whole "love story" is muted here, no surprise because we have a screen test in the movie's most pivotal moment. What's also a surprise is that Brando's stuff is so leaden -- Susannah York proved to be far more emotive in those scenes with Reeve than Brando. Only that last sequence really clicked. The others were like that awkward scene that was restored to SUPERMAN THE MOVIE with Reeve and Brando together -- they truly did seem to be in different movies and utilizing acting styles of their own.

We kept hearing about "heart and soul" with Donner's direction -- but I found that Lester's film (probably because it was actually finished) is a LOT more emotional and moving than this version.

Obviously you have to recommend this to any Superman fan but what I ultimately think it's ironically going to do is make people realize how good of a movie SUPERMAN II actually is -- the theatrical version, not this weird and ultimately unsatisfying "approximation" of what might have been.

It's a fantastic curiosity but definitely not a satisfying movie -- taken on its own terms -- if that makes any sense.

[AndyDursin]

...and they KEPT the scene where Clark beats up the diner guy at the end...even though he's turned back the clock and there's now no purpose in that whole coda!!

What a weird decision that was given the "it never happened"/turn back the clock ending...seriously, just bizarre.

[Neil S. Bulk]

So far no great shakes...

Wait until you get to the re-powering scene.

(you'll get that when you see it)

Neil

OK that scene was great -- easily the best addition to this cut.

I was actually just talking about the shaking.

I agree with everything in your review though I didn't even think the re-powering scene was anything special.

Neil

[AndyDursin]

LOL!

Here's the thing with the repowering scene -- it WOULD have been great had there been some original music there. That music just does not fit, it's obviously been tracked and just feels repetitive.

Anyway Neil...we're in agreement...and I think a lot of the "internet movement" to get this released in the first place is going to be severely crushed by the fact that it's an incomplete and unsatisfying "stand alone" viewing experience.

To Superman fans who know the history, it still functions as a curiosity item, but as a viewing experience it's a total mess.

[Carlson2005]

Obviously you have to recommend this to any Superman fan but what I ultimately think it's ironically going to do is make people realize how good of a movie SUPERMAN II actually is

Nope, can't see that happening even if it does turn out to be as disappointing for me as it was for you - Lester just treats the whole thing as a joke. I really don't want custard pie gags in a superhero movie. Well, unless it's Mystery Men, that is!

[mrsbrody]

>>Obviously you have to recommend this to any Superman fan but what I ultimately think it's ironically going to do is make people realize how good of a movie SUPERMAN II actually is -- the theatrical version, not this weird and ultimately unsatisfying "approximation" of what might have been. <<

That's exactly how I feel about Lester's cut. The story is great and so are the villians, but the entire affair feels slapped together and unfinished. The seemingly endless recap of the first film gets things off to an awful start and the score pretty much cripples the rest of the movie. I'm curious to see this new version, though, for novelty value!

[Neil S. Bulk]

While you may not like Lester's humorous additions and style, there is no denying that the film released in 1980/1981 was a competently completed film. After I saw The Donner Cut, I thought that Lester and the producers must have had a reaction similar to mine watching the footage that is presented on this new DVD. It's a mess. I really think Lester took all the best, salvageable parts from Donner's shoot and fashioned a script and a movie that used what they could to make the best story possible. From that point of view, the Lester version is a success.

Neil

[Eric Paddon]

BUT.....if the final version of II had contained the repowering sequence, I think it would have been flawless. To me, that is the only Brando scene that belongs back in the final cut of II because that scene alone helps tie the two films together with the "father becomes the son" dialogue. If nothing else had been restored to II but that, I would have been content. (Now if only I could create that dream cut and get past the anti-copy measures!!)

[AndyDursin]

Obviously you have to recommend this to any Superman fan but what I ultimately think it's ironically going to do is make people realize how good of a movie SUPERMAN II actually is

Nope, can't see that happening even if it does turn out to be as disappointing for me as it was for you - Lester just treats the whole thing as a joke. I really don't want custard pie gags in a superhero movie. Well, unless it's Mystery Men, that is!

I dunno Trevor, I think you may feel differently after seeing this disaster (at least I'm calling it that from a viewing experience). The entire love story is treated like a joke in DONNER's version! As I wrote in my review Kidder's Lois is so cartoonish in her attempts to prove Clark is Superman that it loses all of the poignancy of Lester's version.

That was the big revelation to me -- that all this supposed "heart and soul" that Donner provided to the series would manifest itself here. Well, I can tell you it ain't happening. In fact the entire love story is a total mess -- and what can you say when a SCREEN TEST is supposed to substitute for the movie's big scene where Lois finds out Clark's identity? There isn't even any fall-out from that moment -- no sooner does he admit "hey I'm Superman" then it cuts to Zod and Company's arrival in Texas! There's no resonance or emotion or anything here.

Eric: you may be surprised at how disposable Brando's scenes are. But I agree, the re-powering moment would have been crucial -- especially if someone had written some original music and the same "Destruction of Krypton" theme not been recycled for the 300th time in this movie.

[AndyDursin]

Review is up!

http://www.andyfilm.com/11-15-06.html

[Eric Paddon]

Boy, that was not the right cue to use to track that scene! When I read that scene in the script version, I kept envisioning something more uplifting and "Destruction of Krypton" isn't right for that.

It was however the power of that scene in the II script that had me interested in this project from the outset, and I think it's unfortunate that it got lost in the shuffle in this determination to create a singular Donner vision.