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Paul MacLean
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#241 Post by Paul MacLean »

I know this is 18 years late, but I finally sat through JFK last night.

It wasn't by choice. I do a "movie night" with friends of mine every Tuesday, and they decided to rent JFK (since their son is studying the assassination in school right now).

To be honest I almost left. I've hated every Oliver Stone film I've ever seen. None of them work dramatically or artistically. They are all overwrought, with totally unbelievable characterizations, corny dialog (which is often unintentionally hilarious) and speculation and half-truths presented as though they are fact.

Anyway, I decided to bite my tongue and consented to watch the film.

I almost wish I hadn't. They rented the "directors cut" of the film, which clocks in at THREE HOURS and FIFTEEN MINUTES. That's almost as long as Lawrence of Arabia -- for a movie that is incessantly talky, convoluted, and shot mostly in interiors.

I have to admit that there are some odd aspects regarding the Kennedy assassination which make the premise of this film potentially interesting.

But Stone takes so bloody long to make his case, and gets hung-up on a lot of irrelevant minutia (of dubious importance). William Goldman and Alan J. Pakula were able to tell Bob Woodwood's and Carl Bernstein's Watergate expose within a reasonable running time in All The President's Men. But somehow Stone needs more than three hours to show Jim Garrison's investigation -- an investigation than relied on far less concrete evidence than Woodword and Bernstein's.

I think everyone agrees that Kevin Costner is not a particularly dynamic or versatile actor, and really rather bland. So what could be worse than three hours and fifteen minutes of Kevin Costner droning on and on and connecting a lot of semi-related (if not downright unrelated) dots? Add to this his fake Louisiana accent that silly-looking pipe in his mouth, and I ask myself "How did anyone ever take this movie seriously?"

Moreover, Stone fails to mention that the real Jim Garrison was in fact relieved of National Guard duty owing to "severe and disabling psychoneurosis". (Of course had this fact been included, any semblance of credibility the film might have had would disintegrate.)

Stone's bad taste and appetite for the lurid is freely indulged in the laughable scenes of Joe Pesci whipping Tommy Lee Jones during a sadomasochistic liaison, while Kevin Bacon -- dressed like Marie Antoinette -- looks on approvingly. :lol:

But if Stone lacks good taste, he lacks tact and decency even more. I was disgusted at how Stone was so eager to make his point that he had to include the archival footage of President Kennedy's head being blown off. And not just once, but several times, and then showing it again -- and again -- this time enlarged it to give the audience a better view.

Did Stone ever stop to think that Jackie, or John Kennedy's children might see his film? But Stone is so self-righteous, so convinced of the legitimacy of his agenda, that he can justify making what is, quite literally, a snuff film -- a snuff film which exploits the death of a US president. Its sick.

In addition, Stone's integration of genuine archival footage with newly shot 16mm footage (which resembles archival footage) was incredibly irresponsible, and served to blur fact with speculation (his intention perhaps?).

On top of all this is the subplot of Jim Garrison's marital problems, which theoretically contributes a "human" element to the film, but only come across like something out of a daytime soap opera.

And I'm sorry to say that even John Williams' contribution didn't amount to much. In fairness, the film is virtually unscorable, with little room for a composer to do anything. Williams' end title is very well-done, but the film is otherwise so repellent and irksome that I just couldn't embrace the music.

Easily among the worst films ever made, at least by a Hollywood "A-list" director -- and certainly the most boring movie I have ever seen.

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AndyDursin
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#242 Post by AndyDursin »

Paul, tell them you want GLORY the next time!

JFK was tiresome. I think people at the time got all caught up in Stone's celebrity but here we are years later and his career is almost DOA. The Jones-Pesci scenes I recall finding utterly hilarious as they held no value to the story, just were put there seemingly for shock value. Even Williams' score beyond that one main track is thankless -- almost exactly like his score for NIXON.

Speaking of that, I actually found NIXON even more boring than JFK. At least JFK also had 500 people who all wanted to put in a role in the movie, including John Candy!

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Paul MacLean
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#243 Post by Paul MacLean »

AndyDursin wrote:At least JFK also had 500 people who all wanted to put in a role in the movie, including John Candy!
Yeah, what was that about? It was like a 70s disaster movie, filled with star cameos -- John Candy, Ed Asner, Donald Sutherland, Kevin Bacon, etc. And what a rip-off that Walter Matthau and Jack Lemmon didn't even have a scene together!

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AndyDursin
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#244 Post by AndyDursin »

Paul MacLean wrote:
AndyDursin wrote:At least JFK also had 500 people who all wanted to put in a role in the movie, including John Candy!
Yeah, what was that about? It was like a 70s disaster movie, filled with star cameos -- John Candy, Ed Asner, Donald Sutherland, Kevin Bacon, etc. And what a rip-off that Walter Matthau and Jack Lemmon didn't even have a scene together!
I totally forgot they were even in the movie! I think all of those actors were just so excited to be there because Stone was at his height of popularity following PLATOON, WALL STREET and BORN ON THE FOURTH OF JULY. It does make the film somewhat interesting on that level, but as a serious chronicle of what happened, or a dramatic work of cinema, it's just incredibly dull...

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#245 Post by Eric Paddon »

JFK is always going to be one of the most disgusting movies of all time because if romanticized one of the most disgusting individuals in the history of American jurisprudence, Jim Garrison, whose witch hunt against Clay Shaw was one of the greatest travesties of all time. It's rather amusing that a three hour movie about Jim Garrison managed to completely zap from existence Garrison's star witness at the original trial, Perry Russo (who has a cameo in the film), who was the ONLY person he had who could allegedly link Clay Shaw to Oswald. The only problem was that Russo only recalled this after he'd been placed under hypnosis and fed a series of leading questions, and later he totally recanted everything he'd said about supposedly being at a party where Shaw and Oswald had been. No Russo, no case. That is the reason why the jury took less than an hour to acquit Shaw, because they knew that Garrison had nothing.

That's not the only thing Stone played fast and loose with, but it would take forever to dissect the many lies he told in this film. Here though is a great resource guide (which I contributed in part to) that breaks some of them down.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/jfkmovie.htm

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Monterey Jack
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#246 Post by Monterey Jack »

The Princess & The Frog: 8/10

A new Disney classic? Not quite, but man, what a treat to see the classic, hand-drawn Disney style again! :D Randy Newman's score didn't have any "Under The Sea"/"Be Our Guest"-style showstoppers, but the songs were jazzy and engaging enough, and the character designs and stylized visual choices were inspired. More, please!

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#247 Post by Eric W. »

Monterey Jack wrote:...but man, what a treat to see the classic, hand-drawn Disney style again!

Way overdue. And it was criminally stupid for them to not use it as long as they did and essentially abandon it.

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AndyDursin
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#248 Post by AndyDursin »

Monterey Jack wrote:The Princess & The Frog: 8/10

A new Disney classic? Not quite, but man, what a treat to see the classic, hand-drawn Disney style again! :D Randy Newman's score didn't have any "Under The Sea"/"Be Our Guest"-style showstoppers, but the songs were jazzy and engaging enough, and the character designs and stylized visual choices were inspired. More, please!
I didn't see the movie but I did hear the music and felt his songs were just DOA. I've seen them criticized in every review, both positive and negative, of the film too, making it a real shame they didn't bring Menken in for this project.

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Paul MacLean
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#249 Post by Paul MacLean »

Continuing my endeavor to catch-up on "acclaimed" movies I've never seen, I rented Fight Club.

What a worthless squandering of good celluloid. On the surface it would seem to have been an indictment of "male violence" -- but Fincher clearly reveled in the endless shots of people spitting up blood, suffering chemical burns and knocking out each other's teeth, so I'm not really sure what he was trying to say (I'd hazard a guess Fincher wasn't sure either).

In fact, to be honest, I think the appeal of this film lies in Tyler Durden representing a kind of narcissistic fantasy for spoiled teen and twenty-somethings of who they wish they could be -- and that's scary. The character lashes out in rage against an "evil" society that has actually never really done anything to harm him. I was unfortunate enough to have to spend a lot of time around fraternity boys during the time this film was released, and most of them had a "Tyler Durden" very narrowly suppressed within them. He's ostensibly a villain, but he taps into the anger of young men -- particularly those who have nothing to be angry about -- and serves as a disturbing inspiration to them.

And the film's "big twist" towards the end was just a rip-off of Psycho (with a little Angel Heart thrown in).

Apart from being a silly, frivolous, pointless waste of time, it is a film that does more harm than good.

Oh...and someone explain why Norton is just fine in the last scene after shooting himself in the head? :?

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#250 Post by AndyDursin »

Monterey Jack wrote:Randy Newman's score didn't have any "Under The Sea"/"Be Our Guest"-style showstoppers
Found out Alan Menken is indeed writing the songs for RAPUNZEL in a "60s rock style". Disney releases it next Thanksgiving.

He's also working on THE SNOW QUEEN for Disney, which is further down the pike...man I've missed his music. May have to pick up the SISTER ACT musical soundtrack just to hear the songs.

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Paul MacLean
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#251 Post by Paul MacLean »

Still trying to catch-up on those movies I've missed over the years. I just watched A.I. for the first time. I didn't like it at all.

For starters this movie was made a little too late. The concept of "race"-based bigotry toward androids, and "what will mankind do with androids when they become a liability?" was already explored in Blade Runner, while the "Pinocchio" metaphor was previously used in Star Trek: The Next Generation (with the character of Data). Even Bicentennial Man (or for that matter Heartbeeps!) covered much of the same ground.

Besides this I found this film very depressing, and creepy. I think part of the problem is that Stanley Kubrick (who developed the project) tended to make films from the perspective of a dispassionate observer, while Spielberg is by nature a sentimentalist, and as a result this film feels awkward. Kubrick favored ambiguous or unhappy endings. Spielberg tends to favor bittersweet or happy endings. So we have a quintessentially Kubrick-esque idea, rife with cerebral -- and disturbing -- scientific speculation, but interpreted through Spielberg's desire to make a kind of modern-day Pinocchio -- with uncomfortable results.

I was put off by the "Flesh Fair", which I found annoyingly preachy -- but fortunately it was redeemed by the unintentionally funny shot of Chris Rock being shot out of the cannon and his face getting lodged in the cage bars. :lol:

There also were a lot of implausibilities in the story. Why would they make a robot child that was incapable of "growing up"? Wouldn't prospective "parents" of such a child be reluctant to adopt him if the robot remained an 8-year-old while they entered into old age? And if David was not designed to eat, why would there be a passageway between his mouth and torso enabling the food to get lodged in his chest cavity? Wouldn't a robot child be programed to know better than to open the door on mommy when she's sitting on the toilet? That's a pretty serious design flaw! And if a robot is designed to mimic a real child, why is he equipped with the ability to pipe phone messages through his mouth?

Why did Brendan Gleeson's hot air balloon resemble the moon? And isn't a slow-moving hot air balloon an impractical way of searching for runaway androids? Why was Jude Law trying to escape the police, when logically they would be able to access the memories on his "hard drive" and thus prove he was NOT the murderer? Why was William Hurt still operating out of a half-submerged office building in an abandoned city? Why did Hurt take so long to fetch the team who created David (giving David time to discover all the other "Davids" and jump off the building)? Why didn't Hurt try to search for David after he jumped off the building?

I also was uncomfortable with idea of a child being taken under the wing of a male prostitute (even if they are both robots). The ending was very unsatisfying, in that David finally gets back his mommy (albeit a cloned version) -- but then she dies after one day. :roll:

I will say that the effects were superb, and I thought the film was very well-acted. The scenes between David and his mother generally worked well, and the character of "Teddy" (who served as a kind of "Jiminey Cricket" to David's Pinocchio) was really rather interesting -- in fact probably the most interesting character in the film.

Janusz Kaminski's photography didn't bother me as much as it has in other films, though the usual blown-out backgrounds gave me a bit of a headache. And as always the film was very grainy, almost like it was shot on old 16mm film. John Williams' score was very good, and especially liked his end title, but I don't know if I could enjoy it on disc because it would resurrect the very unpleasant feelings I got from the film.
Last edited by Paul MacLean on Mon Dec 28, 2009 10:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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AndyDursin
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#252 Post by AndyDursin »

John Williams' score was very good, and especially liked his end title, but I don't know if I could enjoy it on disc because it would resurrect the very unpleasant feelings I got from the film.
It's the one score I think I've ever heard that I can't go back to because of the film itself. I agree totally on the film.

Here's my original review from 2001...



A.I. ARTIFICAL INTELLIGENCE (**): Too Stanley Kubrick for Steven Spielberg fans and too Spielberg for Kubrick aficionados, A.I. is a bleak, alternately compelling and muddled movie that stays with you long after it's over for all the wrong reasons.

Like the old saying "you can't go home again," the movie is unfortunate proof that the once-master genre filmmaker has lost touch with where he came from. Not even a marvelous score by John Williams can bail out Spielberg from one of the most disorganized and under-developed films he's ever produced.

The story is a loose, electronic version of PINOCCHIO, based on a Brian Aldiss work that was initiated by Stanley Kubrick years ago, before Spielberg picked up the reigns after his death in 1999. Haley Joel Osment, who showed remarkable restraint and depth as a child performer in "The Sixth Sense," has an even more difficult task at hand here: having to carry the film as David, the first prototype android child with the capacity to show genuine human warmth and love.

His human parents (Frances O'Connor, Sam Robards) try to love him, but after their own son -- hospitalized at the start of the film -- is restored to health, a series of accidents leaves them wanting to abandon David despite his programmed love for them.

An agonized O'Connor opts to leave the "mecha" in a forest (for no apparent reason, she does it in a location nearby the factory where he was created), but David -- inspired by "Pinocchio" -- decides to start out on a journey to find the "Blue Fairy" that will change him into a real boy, in order to prove his love for his mommy.

It all sounds like vintage Spielberg, but what follows from that point on is very much a Kubrick piece. This future -- where the polar ice caps have melted and flooded major cities like Manhattan -- is a dark and dreary place: broken-down androids are hunted down and destroyed in so-called "Flesh Fairs," other machines (like Jude Law's woefully under-utilized Gigolo Joe) are used for pleasure, all the while humans seem to be dwindling in numbers (though this is never clearly explained in the film).

Spielberg, working from his first self-authored screenplay since "Close Encounters," has used a three-act structure here that hammers home the same themes over and over again -- life is tough, humans don't treat each other properly, the world is a big, dark place -- but does so without elaborating upon countless important issues in the story. The intellectual level of the various robots is never addressed (David's teddy bear seems like Teddy Ruxpin one moment and a knowing sage the next), while the motivation of O'Connor and her husband is never fully delineated. Ditto for William Hurt's "Geppetto," whose scientific genius suffers from the same, thinly-drawn motivations that plagued Richard Attenborough's role in "Jurassic Park."

Each act of A.I. has its own problems, making one constantly feel that Spielberg isn't entirely comfortable working within a story framework that is as much Kubrick-esque as it is his own. What he's made is a wildly uneven picture that's never boring, but ultimately never really engaging, either.

The first part puts David through a torturous series of sequences designed to make us see in the inhumanity in humanity -- but the scenes often come off like Spielberg trying desperately to distance himself from the kinds of "happy suburbia" pictures he became renowned for.

The movie's second half -- particularly disappointing from a visual standpoint -- resembles, of all things, MAD MAX BEYOND THUNDERDOME with its carnival-like freakshow of the robots being mauled and ripped apart for the pleasure of beer-guzzling audiences. Again, Spielberg shows he's lost his touch in staging such elaborate sequences, with the neon-lit bikers in pursuit of David baring more than a passing resemblance to the light cycles of TRON and Janusz Kaminski's cinematography failing to bring anything to the table that we haven't seen before.

What follows thereafter is puzzling to an extreme. Spielberg caps his uneven tale with a bizarre salute to 2001's trippy climax, with Earth encountering another Ice Age while David sits and waits for the resolution to his fate. The conclusion is best left unspoken, but it's a somewhat ambiguous finale that's part fairy-tale, part maudlin sentimentality, implying a spiritual resolution that it hasn't come close to achieving.

And maybe that's the most distressing thing about A.I. -- the picture misses every opportunity it has to elaborate upon the themes of human and android interaction, what lies beyond this plain of existence, and the entire question of what constitutes love. Spielberg rarely addresses these issues in a larger sense during the film, and it shows: the movie is all surface, artifice, as unreal as the title character itself.

And, for all of the fine work of Osment, Spielberg never gives us a reason to care about the android-child since, simply, he isn't human. Law gives a colorful performance but he's not given enough to do, while O'Connor comes off as an icy opposite of a typical parent in a Spielberg film (whether that was the intention or not is another matter). Hurt's role veers from mad scientist to sympathetic parent, and Spielberg never has an answer as to what his role should be in relation to David's quest.

The film's saving grace, then, is John Williams' score. Williams has assisted Spielberg so many times in the past that most viewers have lost count of their classic collaborations. A.I. will likely not be viewed as one of Spielberg's best films (indeed, you can sense that many viewers will feel betrayed by the studio's deceptive, E.T.-like marketing of the film to family audiences), but Williams' score -- marked by a haunting, gorgeous theme that's heartbreaking and lyrical -- sings with conflict, tension, emotion, and love. His music provides the movie, its protagonist, and its problematic structure with a presence that A.I. as a film never comes close to matching.

But why should we surprised that a "collaboration" between Kubrick and Spielberg resulted in a mixed-up movie filled with conflicting emotions and messages? Spielberg's best movies are about real people. Kubrick's films are often about machines and the world surrounding them -- or at least not human beings in the traditional definition of the word. Spielberg said that he felt Kubrick guiding him through production, but the movie only ends up combining the problems that have plagued both filmmakers throughout their respective careers. If Spielberg had gone out and made HIS film, or Kubrick shot the picture himself, perhaps A.I. would have had a unique, consistent vision. (It's also hard to understand why Kubrick held out from making the movie for years, citing that the effects would have cost too much. Despite some "Mission to Mars"-like pseudo-beings that appear at the end, there isn't much in the way of innovative CGI here that couldn't have been pulled off to an effective degree over a decade ago).

A.I.'s moving final shot is a heartbreaker not only in its relation to the story but also in that Spielberg, after nearly 140 minutes, finally found a moment he felt comfortable in filming here. It's just unfortunate that it had to be the last one.

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AndyDursin
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#253 Post by AndyDursin »

Just for fun here's my Mailbag on A.I. from 2001...including comments from Jeff Bond and our own Michael Karoly.

BTW I stopped doing Mailbags since people can now leave "hit and run comments" at the bottom of every FSM article, most of which aren't worth responding to (I've found).

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/article ... owdown.asp

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#254 Post by mkaroly »

AndyDursin wrote:Just for fun here's my Mailbag on A.I. from 2001...including comments from Jeff Bond and our own Michael Karoly.

BTW I stopped doing Mailbags since people can now leave "hit and run comments" at the bottom of every FSM article, most of which aren't worth responding to (I've found).

http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/article ... owdown.asp
Lol....those were the days! Actually, I haven't changed much. Here is a review (minus the summary of the film) I wrote for friends and co-workers when I went back and watched all of Spielberg's films and tried to analyze them and show continuity of thematic developments and stuff. I am not a professional, so it is what it is.

A.I. - This was a project which Stanley Kubrick had intended to make after he finished EYES WIDE SHUT. The project had been in development since 1974, and after Kubrick died, Spielberg decided to make the film to honor Kubrick. Spielberg made some changes to some of the sets and such, and added the story’s heart by essentially retelling the Pinocchio story while retaining some of Kubrick’s darker vision. The result, for me, is an incredibly deep film that is a darker version of Spielberg’s own E.T. Osment did an amazing job as David; there are several chilling scenes, including David’s discovery of his “brothers” and a dark scene in which David, in despair after learning the truth, tries to commit suicide. John Williams’ musical contribution counted as one of his best and most moving late period scores for me. The final twenty minutes of the film are a cinematic goldmine of the power and magic of film. The story is very emotional and intimate, though it has its flaws. There isn’t a lot of character development to speak of outside of David, and Jude Law’s character was not developed at all, which I believe was a missed opportunity. The Flesh Fair sequence was made less horrifying by the rock music of Ministry and several goofy (and somewhat out-of-place) moments which made the sequence seem more like a nightmare roller derby. Some of the Rouge City moments seemed unnecessary as well. Some found Teddy to be annoying, but his inclusion in the story was part of Kubrick’s original vision for the film, and in Spielberg’s film, Teddy’s part was more like that of Jiminy Cricket.

The themes of abandonment and the pain of separation (especially in terms of the mother-child relationship) are addressed in a powerful way in this film. David, a Mecha who can be programmed to love, is adopted by parents who are grieving over the possible death of their only child. Monica and her husband take on that responsibility, and in a tender and tragic scene, Monica repeats the code that makes David love her unconditionally. But David is a Mecha and unable to be fully human, and when Martin recovers, David is abandoned by his mother. David’s desires center on love and family (which was his programming). In Gigolo Joe he finds a surrogate father figure, but the family is incomplete without Monica. As David uncovers more clues and journeys to New York to find the Blue Fairy, the story takes a surprising twist. In one of the film’s most chilling moments, David discovers that he is not a unique boy; he is a mechanical replica of Professor Hobby’s deceased son. David never finds completion in a father-son relationship in the movie; Spielberg’s focus was more on David’s desire and need for maternal love and affection after being separated from her and the family. Although Gigolo Joe was an exception, the other men in David’s life (Henry and Professor Hobby) were not good father figures. As in previous pictures, the desire for family restoration and parental love is a foundational element.

The film also addressed issues of the moral and responsible use of technology. In the film it is clear that Spielberg wants the viewer to sympathize with the Mechas. They are abused by humans even if (as in the case of Professor Hobby) their intentions are good. Although Monica and Henry decide to program David to love them as parents, they were unable to see it through. The machines in this film were able to love more and understand the importance and meaning of the word better than the human beings did. Spirituality is addressed as well. The Blue Fairy has the appearance of the Virgin Mary (in my opinion), and in the coda, the Mechas (not aliens) who find David tell him that there is much they can do, but ultimately they are not God (and neither were Monica or Professor Hobby). The film is filled with Spielberg’s typical penetrating light, and I believe this film is just as intimate and sincere as anything he had done up to this point. (A)

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#255 Post by Jedbu »

Personally, I agree with mkaroly about AI, and after reading Bugliosi's definitive book on the JFK assassination I now have to dismiss Stone's film (thought Spacek's character one of the worst female characters in recent movie history and the actress' worst performance, as well; but I did think that Oldman did a pretty good job as Oswald).

Caught up with DISTRICT 9 on BD yesterday and was totally blown away by the concept, the execution and the overall feel of the film. Always compelling with an astounding performance by Sharlto Copley as the man who finds his humanity while losing it at the same time. Did not see it in the theater due to some pressing projects, but what an eye-opening film! The deleted scene of the rationalization for treating the aliens as lower than the dust by some black bureaucrat should have been kept in the original cut-a nice punch in the gut type of scene that might have been a bit much for some, but probably not enough for others.

Also saw NIGHT AT THE MUSEUM-BATTLE OF THE SMITHSONIAN as well, and aside from Azaria doing a very funny Karloff imitation and the Roman soldier riding in on a squirrel, it seemed like something made because it was expected to be made, not for any entertainment reasons. Considering the reviews and box office for AMELIA, you have to wonder if the Earhart character here was more interesting.

SHERLOCK HOLMES is a lot of fun with Downey and Law having great chemistry and it is so nice to see Watson portrayed in such a dynamic way for a change. Two quibbles: Rachel MacAdams totally miscast, and PLEASE can we call for a moritorium on desaturated color! I am so tired of movies shot with color film stock looking like some cheap process or that the cinematographer is colorblind. God, do I miss glorious Technicolor! :x

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