I was an early adoptor of CD, despite my older sister (who had a big LP collection) telling me "You're wasting your money on those compact discs -- its not going to last and in a few years you wan't have anything to play them on or anyone to fix your player."
A few years later I got an 8mm camcorder, which raised some eyebrows -- "You didn't get VHS?" But 8mm (and its close-cousin Hi8) dominated camcorders for the next ten years.
So if Toshiba came-out with an HD-DVD player under $150, I would certainly take the plunge.
Some type of HD home-viewing format is going to take-over, and my feeling is its HD-DVD. Blu-Ray seems to be going the way of PSP. And although there is talk of everything becoming downloadable, standard definition downloads of movies and TV shows have only just begun, so HD dowloads are a ways off.
More and more people have HDTVs, and are going to want to see movies in HD.
"Tech" Thread: Blu Ray, HD-DVD, Video Games, HDTV
-
AndyDursin
- Posts: 35759
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm
- Location: RI
As more and more info comes out, it seems Blu Ray is in much worse shape than apparently was initially thought.
Eric W. mentioned porn MONTHS ago as a major selling point...if that's the case then HD-DVD just won the format war, which Harry Knowles even posted today at AICN.
check it out... (or not, lol):
CES 2007: HD DVD versus Blu-ray - The porn industry says HD DVD
Aaron McKenna
January 11, 2007 12:39
Las Vegas (NV) - Knowing their audience quite well, the adult entertainment industry holds their annual get together in Las Vegas to coincide with the CES. There is also a very pertinent crossover between the adult and tech industries - porn has a tendency to drive, and be driven, by technology. Which means HD DVD when it comes to high-def.
Quite famously in the war between Betamax and VHS the latter won especially because the adult industry preferred it. If you've been around long enough, you probably remember that the very early home video rental stores were primarily responsible for driving Betamax out of the market. And those stores carried almost exclusively pornographic content.
Although the market environments from then do not really compare to today's home video market, parallels are drawn between the Betamax-VHS battle to the ongoing and escalating fight between Blu-ray and HD DVD. One of the key questions at this year's CES actually is "Which high-def format will win the current format war - Blu-ray or HD DVD?" Surprisingly, it seems that there is no such question in the minds of the adult industry luminaries.
Putting myself through the arduous trek through the floor of the adult expo I did a quick straw poll on, the virtues of HD DVD versus Blu-ray, and the answer from a dozen companies, big and small, including Pink Visual and Bangbros editor-in-chief, is going into a single direction: HD DVD is the preferred format. Period.
One of the big problems they have with Blu-ray is its expense, followed by its market share. "Blu-ray has superior quality, yes," said a spokesperson for porn studio Bangbros, "but HD DVD is easier to produce, cheaper to produce and there are more HD DVD players in homes than there are Blu-ray players, for example in the Xbox 360."
Pink Visual heavily complained about the fact that Blu-ray discs cannot be replicated and a range of other studios, who did not want to be mentioned by name indicated that the cost of going with Blu-ray cancels the technology as a possible HD solution for this industry. "Only bigger studios can afford Blu-ray, and even then it's not economical," we were told.
It would seem that either Blu-ray has to do some catching up very quickly. But we got the strange feeling that HD DVD has won the format war already, at least in the porn industry.
http://www.tgdaily.com/2007/01/11/ces20 ... d_blu_ray/
Eric W. mentioned porn MONTHS ago as a major selling point...if that's the case then HD-DVD just won the format war, which Harry Knowles even posted today at AICN.
check it out... (or not, lol):
CES 2007: HD DVD versus Blu-ray - The porn industry says HD DVD
Aaron McKenna
January 11, 2007 12:39
Las Vegas (NV) - Knowing their audience quite well, the adult entertainment industry holds their annual get together in Las Vegas to coincide with the CES. There is also a very pertinent crossover between the adult and tech industries - porn has a tendency to drive, and be driven, by technology. Which means HD DVD when it comes to high-def.
Quite famously in the war between Betamax and VHS the latter won especially because the adult industry preferred it. If you've been around long enough, you probably remember that the very early home video rental stores were primarily responsible for driving Betamax out of the market. And those stores carried almost exclusively pornographic content.
Although the market environments from then do not really compare to today's home video market, parallels are drawn between the Betamax-VHS battle to the ongoing and escalating fight between Blu-ray and HD DVD. One of the key questions at this year's CES actually is "Which high-def format will win the current format war - Blu-ray or HD DVD?" Surprisingly, it seems that there is no such question in the minds of the adult industry luminaries.
Putting myself through the arduous trek through the floor of the adult expo I did a quick straw poll on, the virtues of HD DVD versus Blu-ray, and the answer from a dozen companies, big and small, including Pink Visual and Bangbros editor-in-chief, is going into a single direction: HD DVD is the preferred format. Period.
One of the big problems they have with Blu-ray is its expense, followed by its market share. "Blu-ray has superior quality, yes," said a spokesperson for porn studio Bangbros, "but HD DVD is easier to produce, cheaper to produce and there are more HD DVD players in homes than there are Blu-ray players, for example in the Xbox 360."
Pink Visual heavily complained about the fact that Blu-ray discs cannot be replicated and a range of other studios, who did not want to be mentioned by name indicated that the cost of going with Blu-ray cancels the technology as a possible HD solution for this industry. "Only bigger studios can afford Blu-ray, and even then it's not economical," we were told.
It would seem that either Blu-ray has to do some catching up very quickly. But we got the strange feeling that HD DVD has won the format war already, at least in the porn industry.
http://www.tgdaily.com/2007/01/11/ces20 ... d_blu_ray/
-
Carlson2005
-
AndyDursin
- Posts: 35759
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm
- Location: RI
-
Paul MacLean
- Posts: 7533
- Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:26 pm
- Location: New York
Not so fast. Yesterday, The Digital Bits had some comments regarding porn and high-definition :
Then there's this: A few readers have e-mailed us today about the news that some of the leading porn companies, like Digital Underground and Wicked Pictures, have decided to back HD-DVD for cost and ease of production reasons."Porn decided the VHS vs. Betamax format war, so it'll decide the HD format war too." is the typical comment. Here's why I doubt it: Back in the days of the VHS vs. Beta format war, the only way to watch porn was to visit a seedy adult movie theater or to spool up a Super-8 film. So when cheap, convenient porn on tape finally arrived, it was a HUGE deal, demand was massive and it benefited VHS greatly. The difference today is, cheap porn is already available EVERYWHERE on the Internet and particularly on good old standard DVD. Also, have any of you actually seen naked people in high-definition? Let me tell you, it's often a much better idea in theory than in reality. Porn stars may look sexy as all get out in standard definition, but... well, maybe not so much in HD. You can't hide those plastic surgery scars, stretch marks and a__-pimples in high-def. I'm just saying. Bottom line: Porn companies backing HD-DVD is not insignificant, but I doubt very much that porn will decide this format war.
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/mytwocent ... ml#ceswrap
Very good points, I think. For the record, I'm not completely sold on the longevity of either format, let alone declaring a winner.
Mark
Then there's this: A few readers have e-mailed us today about the news that some of the leading porn companies, like Digital Underground and Wicked Pictures, have decided to back HD-DVD for cost and ease of production reasons."Porn decided the VHS vs. Betamax format war, so it'll decide the HD format war too." is the typical comment. Here's why I doubt it: Back in the days of the VHS vs. Beta format war, the only way to watch porn was to visit a seedy adult movie theater or to spool up a Super-8 film. So when cheap, convenient porn on tape finally arrived, it was a HUGE deal, demand was massive and it benefited VHS greatly. The difference today is, cheap porn is already available EVERYWHERE on the Internet and particularly on good old standard DVD. Also, have any of you actually seen naked people in high-definition? Let me tell you, it's often a much better idea in theory than in reality. Porn stars may look sexy as all get out in standard definition, but... well, maybe not so much in HD. You can't hide those plastic surgery scars, stretch marks and a__-pimples in high-def. I'm just saying. Bottom line: Porn companies backing HD-DVD is not insignificant, but I doubt very much that porn will decide this format war.
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/mytwocent ... ml#ceswrap
Very good points, I think. For the record, I'm not completely sold on the longevity of either format, let alone declaring a winner.
Mark
-
AndyDursin
- Posts: 35759
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm
- Location: RI
Of course Bill is right, though truth be told, nobody here declared a winner either (I was only mentioning that in regard to Eric's point about porn).
I completely disagree, though, that there isn't "longevity" in these formats. After watching BLACK RAIN and several of Universal's recent high definition offerings (DUNE and THE HULK), I think anyone who owns an HDTV will absolutely NEED to own a high-definition DVD format, be it HD or Blu Ray. There's no comparison on these titles between real HD and a standard upscaled DVD (now that doesn't apply to EVERY movie but for films like this it sure does). Once they shut off analog transmissions and everyone will HAVE to have an HDTV likely within the next 3-4 years, the validity and demand for these formats is only going to strengthen.
In the meantime, as I wrote in my column this week, we have a long way to go before either format takes hold of the masses -- and maybe not until HDTV really seizes the attention of the masses will that happen. Warner's adoption of a combo disc for Blu Ray and HD-DVD seems to indicate that, while HD-DVD sales are brisker than Blu Ray so far, neither is really generating a lot of heat in the big picture.
I do continue to remain skeptical about Blu Ray. It's just common sense that two battling formats with similar attributes and performance is going to come down to something as simple as cost -- and Blu Ray remains prohibitively more expensive than HD-DVD, with no apparent (so far) advantages as its less-expensive (to manufacture and purchase) competition.
Blu Ray's big announcements this week were just a lot more Sony posturing. In lieu of what was unquestionably a disappointing (to put it kindly) PS3 launch, they made a huge deal about the studios they have under their umbrella and also employed a lot of fuzzy logic and PR spin to say they're "winning."
After hearing a lot of their spin, the first thing I thought of was going back a decade and looking at the launch of DVD, which I was covering for FSM and Home Movies up in Canada. A lot of people forget this, but Fox and Disney (current Blu Ray only studios) were onboard DIVX and not DVD as well. For months all we heard about was how Fox and Disney would NEVER be releasing a DVD and how DIVX (the Circuit City "destructable rental disc") would gain from having them exclusive to their format.
Of course, we all saw how long that studio exclusivity worked out for DIVX...I'm not saying Blu Ray isn't in better shape but there continues to be no reason for consumers to pay twice as much for a format that, to date, has shown no inherent attributes that make it superior to its competition (yes we all know it has more storage space, but why don't the discs look superior? sound superior? offer more features? By the time Sony figures it out we could be into the next decade!).
I completely disagree, though, that there isn't "longevity" in these formats. After watching BLACK RAIN and several of Universal's recent high definition offerings (DUNE and THE HULK), I think anyone who owns an HDTV will absolutely NEED to own a high-definition DVD format, be it HD or Blu Ray. There's no comparison on these titles between real HD and a standard upscaled DVD (now that doesn't apply to EVERY movie but for films like this it sure does). Once they shut off analog transmissions and everyone will HAVE to have an HDTV likely within the next 3-4 years, the validity and demand for these formats is only going to strengthen.
In the meantime, as I wrote in my column this week, we have a long way to go before either format takes hold of the masses -- and maybe not until HDTV really seizes the attention of the masses will that happen. Warner's adoption of a combo disc for Blu Ray and HD-DVD seems to indicate that, while HD-DVD sales are brisker than Blu Ray so far, neither is really generating a lot of heat in the big picture.
I do continue to remain skeptical about Blu Ray. It's just common sense that two battling formats with similar attributes and performance is going to come down to something as simple as cost -- and Blu Ray remains prohibitively more expensive than HD-DVD, with no apparent (so far) advantages as its less-expensive (to manufacture and purchase) competition.
Blu Ray's big announcements this week were just a lot more Sony posturing. In lieu of what was unquestionably a disappointing (to put it kindly) PS3 launch, they made a huge deal about the studios they have under their umbrella and also employed a lot of fuzzy logic and PR spin to say they're "winning."
After hearing a lot of their spin, the first thing I thought of was going back a decade and looking at the launch of DVD, which I was covering for FSM and Home Movies up in Canada. A lot of people forget this, but Fox and Disney (current Blu Ray only studios) were onboard DIVX and not DVD as well. For months all we heard about was how Fox and Disney would NEVER be releasing a DVD and how DIVX (the Circuit City "destructable rental disc") would gain from having them exclusive to their format.
Of course, we all saw how long that studio exclusivity worked out for DIVX...I'm not saying Blu Ray isn't in better shape but there continues to be no reason for consumers to pay twice as much for a format that, to date, has shown no inherent attributes that make it superior to its competition (yes we all know it has more storage space, but why don't the discs look superior? sound superior? offer more features? By the time Sony figures it out we could be into the next decade!).
-
Paul MacLean
- Posts: 7533
- Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:26 pm
- Location: New York
Anyway, Andy's latest column has me thinking...
The new Sanjuro/Yojimbo set sounds awesome, and I'm tempted to get it...but then I think "I already have the first edition. Why pay all that money for another standard definition version when it will certainly be released on HD one of these day?"
While I'm not about to drop $300 on an HD DVD player, neither I am going to buy any "new editions" of DVDs I already own.
So for die-hard movie collectors, I think we're entering a period of limbo. It will be interesting to see how "special edition" reissues fare in this season of format uncertainty.
The new Sanjuro/Yojimbo set sounds awesome, and I'm tempted to get it...but then I think "I already have the first edition. Why pay all that money for another standard definition version when it will certainly be released on HD one of these day?"
While I'm not about to drop $300 on an HD DVD player, neither I am going to buy any "new editions" of DVDs I already own.
So for die-hard movie collectors, I think we're entering a period of limbo. It will be interesting to see how "special edition" reissues fare in this season of format uncertainty.
Sorry if I wasn't clear about my "declare a winner" comment, Andy -- that wasn't directed at anyone here. I was only speaking for myself.
I don't need to be sold on the picture and sound quality of these formats -- as I mentioned elsewhere earlier, I had a Toshiba HD-DVD player for a few weeks last year and the picture knocked my socks off.
Right now, the only thing holding me back is the stupid format exclusives. I'd probably buy another HD-DVD player right now, but many of the titles I really want are from studios that are aligned with the Blu-ray camp.
I am keeping an eye on the forthcoming combi-players. They may end up being a good compromise -- for the consumer. But I'm not sure how that helps the individual formats. Same thing goes for that BR/HD-DVD combi-disc. How does that end up benefitting either format? Those are the questions that make me wonder about longevity. I also notice that neither are getting much push in the retail stores. You have to make a special effort to find them in a Best Buy, for example.
I have no doubt we'll always have some kind of HD disc in the future. But whether it will be BD, HD-DVD, or perhaps some new, compromised version, I'm not sure.
I really don't expect either format to take off until this ridiculous "war" is settled. And if both sides can't reach some sort of compromise, I can see both dying a slow death. (I'm speaking as someone who's invested heavily in SACDs and DVD-As, and we know how that format war turned out.)
Mark
I don't need to be sold on the picture and sound quality of these formats -- as I mentioned elsewhere earlier, I had a Toshiba HD-DVD player for a few weeks last year and the picture knocked my socks off.
Right now, the only thing holding me back is the stupid format exclusives. I'd probably buy another HD-DVD player right now, but many of the titles I really want are from studios that are aligned with the Blu-ray camp.I am keeping an eye on the forthcoming combi-players. They may end up being a good compromise -- for the consumer. But I'm not sure how that helps the individual formats. Same thing goes for that BR/HD-DVD combi-disc. How does that end up benefitting either format? Those are the questions that make me wonder about longevity. I also notice that neither are getting much push in the retail stores. You have to make a special effort to find them in a Best Buy, for example.
I have no doubt we'll always have some kind of HD disc in the future. But whether it will be BD, HD-DVD, or perhaps some new, compromised version, I'm not sure.
I really don't expect either format to take off until this ridiculous "war" is settled. And if both sides can't reach some sort of compromise, I can see both dying a slow death. (I'm speaking as someone who's invested heavily in SACDs and DVD-As, and we know how that format war turned out.)
Mark
-
AndyDursin
- Posts: 35759
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm
- Location: RI
Excellent points all Mark, I totally understand. I haven't invested in either format in terms of a standalone player either. Despite its audio limitations, the Xbox 360 add-on drive for HD-DVDs was worth it for me (at $199 it's the most affordable of all options by far), but I would hesitate to invest in a standalone player at this point.
The combo discs and players are intriguing but if you are an HD-DVD fan the Blu Ray aspect is only going to drive the price up. Not sure how that will benefit the consumers in the long run as well. If BOTH formats end up being "winners" I can't see, again, how the more inherently expensive format stands to gain overall.
The combo discs and players are intriguing but if you are an HD-DVD fan the Blu Ray aspect is only going to drive the price up. Not sure how that will benefit the consumers in the long run as well. If BOTH formats end up being "winners" I can't see, again, how the more inherently expensive format stands to gain overall.
-
AndyDursin
- Posts: 35759
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm
- Location: RI
-
Carlson2005
More porno pranks:
Sony, Shunning Porn Producers, May Hurt Blu-ray Sales
Sony may have shot itself in the foot by resolving not to permit its disc duplicators to produce "adult content" on Blu-ray discs, several consumer electronics and DVD websites observed Thursday. One adult-film producer, Digital Playground, told the British online publication The Inquirer, that it had decided to switch from Blu-ray to HD DVD because "Sony has said to the replicators that if you replicate adult, you'll lose your license." The Inquirer quoted Jake Richter, an analyst at Jon Peddie Research as saying in a report to clients that many people believe that Sony's Betamax video tape format died because the adult movie industry was barred from using it. "Is Sony doomed to repeat one of the mistakes of the past? It seems like that may be the case," he wrote. Likewise, PC World magazine commented that Sony ought to "remember what happened more than two decades ago, when the adult film industry was forced to produce its content on VHS, and not Sony's Betamax." However, Martin Lynch of the IDG news service wrote that some porn produces are in fact finding Blu-ray disc manufacturers who are willing to work with them, adding, "You can say a lot of things about Sony but stupid isn't one of them. Well, most of the time anyway. There is no way that Sony can ignore the boost that porn can give the Blu-ray format."
Sony, Shunning Porn Producers, May Hurt Blu-ray Sales
Sony may have shot itself in the foot by resolving not to permit its disc duplicators to produce "adult content" on Blu-ray discs, several consumer electronics and DVD websites observed Thursday. One adult-film producer, Digital Playground, told the British online publication The Inquirer, that it had decided to switch from Blu-ray to HD DVD because "Sony has said to the replicators that if you replicate adult, you'll lose your license." The Inquirer quoted Jake Richter, an analyst at Jon Peddie Research as saying in a report to clients that many people believe that Sony's Betamax video tape format died because the adult movie industry was barred from using it. "Is Sony doomed to repeat one of the mistakes of the past? It seems like that may be the case," he wrote. Likewise, PC World magazine commented that Sony ought to "remember what happened more than two decades ago, when the adult film industry was forced to produce its content on VHS, and not Sony's Betamax." However, Martin Lynch of the IDG news service wrote that some porn produces are in fact finding Blu-ray disc manufacturers who are willing to work with them, adding, "You can say a lot of things about Sony but stupid isn't one of them. Well, most of the time anyway. There is no way that Sony can ignore the boost that porn can give the Blu-ray format."
-
Paul MacLean
- Posts: 7533
- Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:26 pm
- Location: New York
Thanks!Jack Bauer wrote:^^ This post wins the entire thread outright.
As for HD DVD, after visiting Andy last week and sampling the few HD DVDs he has thus far, I must say I'm sold.
To be sure, not all of them are mind-blowingly superior to regular DVD -- some (like Excalibur) look sharper and more clearly defined, but its not akin to the difference between VHS and DVD.
But, like Andy has mentioned, the titles which will blow you away are things like The Searchers, and Black Rain. The difference is truly striking.
I suspect part of the reason some HD DVDs look better than others is that some movies are mastered off prints, whereas others go back to the original negative.
-
AndyDursin
- Posts: 35759
- Joined: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:45 pm
- Location: RI
Here's some potentially huge news for HD-DVD...
HD DVD Promotions Group Touts Spielberg Classics 'Jaws,' 'Jurassic,' 'E.T.'
Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 03:04 PM ET
Tags: Disc Announcements, Universal (all tags)
Generating lightning fast buzz among early adopters, the HD DVD Promotions Group has added a trio of exclusive Spielberg classics to the "Coming Soon" section of its 2007 HD DVD release list, suggesting that the first of the director's long-awaited classics may finally be hitting the format.
The group, which is the official promotional organization for format backers including Universal and Toshiba, routinely updates its HD DVD title list (which can be found in PDF form here) with officially announced titles, as well as those confirmed to the group as being in the planning stages by the major studios.
Though not all of the "Coming Soon" titles the group has been listing on its site for the past year have actually seen release, the list does provide a strong indicator of what fans might expect in the coming months.
So needless to say, with the appearance of the Steven Spielberg classics 'Jaws,' 'Jurassic Park' and 'E.T.,' hopes are now high among HD DVD fans that the director's first titles will hit high-def this year.
Of course, as DVD enthusiasts know all too well, Spielberg turned out to be one of the longest hold-outs of the standard-def format, refusing to release his major titles for many years despite much pleading from the fanbase. It is also worth noting that Universal itself, in a press release and statements made only late last week, promised 100 new HD DVD titles in the coming year, but ino Spielberg titles were included on the list pending "filmmaker involvement." So we'll take a wait-and-see attitude towards the news, if only for fear of being disappointed.
Should even one of these Spielberg gems see release this year, however, it would certainly prove to be a boost for the HD DVD format, as most of the director's titles are currently distributed by Universal Studios releases, the sole studio holdout from the Blu-ray camp.
As always, stay tuned... we'll keep you posted.
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/ ... _E.T._/454
HD DVD Promotions Group Touts Spielberg Classics 'Jaws,' 'Jurassic,' 'E.T.'
Tue Jan 30, 2007 at 03:04 PM ET
Tags: Disc Announcements, Universal (all tags)
Generating lightning fast buzz among early adopters, the HD DVD Promotions Group has added a trio of exclusive Spielberg classics to the "Coming Soon" section of its 2007 HD DVD release list, suggesting that the first of the director's long-awaited classics may finally be hitting the format.
The group, which is the official promotional organization for format backers including Universal and Toshiba, routinely updates its HD DVD title list (which can be found in PDF form here) with officially announced titles, as well as those confirmed to the group as being in the planning stages by the major studios.
Though not all of the "Coming Soon" titles the group has been listing on its site for the past year have actually seen release, the list does provide a strong indicator of what fans might expect in the coming months.
So needless to say, with the appearance of the Steven Spielberg classics 'Jaws,' 'Jurassic Park' and 'E.T.,' hopes are now high among HD DVD fans that the director's first titles will hit high-def this year.
Of course, as DVD enthusiasts know all too well, Spielberg turned out to be one of the longest hold-outs of the standard-def format, refusing to release his major titles for many years despite much pleading from the fanbase. It is also worth noting that Universal itself, in a press release and statements made only late last week, promised 100 new HD DVD titles in the coming year, but ino Spielberg titles were included on the list pending "filmmaker involvement." So we'll take a wait-and-see attitude towards the news, if only for fear of being disappointed.
Should even one of these Spielberg gems see release this year, however, it would certainly prove to be a boost for the HD DVD format, as most of the director's titles are currently distributed by Universal Studios releases, the sole studio holdout from the Blu-ray camp.
As always, stay tuned... we'll keep you posted.
http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/ ... _E.T._/454