STAR WARS: THE FORCE AWAKENS - Blu-Ray Thoughts

[AndyDursin]

Yeah thankfully the Luke theory must have been the fanboy speculation but it never made sense -- hey let's turn one of the most legendary heroes of all-time into a villain? LOL. Sure. They must be saving his appearance as a big reveal in the film however. If they DID do that, almost certainly there would have been griping far and wide by now.

I've managed to avoid the spoilers. Apparently the FSM thread was plagued with them before it opened thanks to one particular idiot.

[Monterey Jack]

8.5/10

It's fun...mighty fun. Yes, it is a de facto remake of the original Star Wars, but it replicates the same sense of scrappy, gee-whiz charm of the OT, with a pleasing mix of nostalgic old faces (really old faces as far as Carrie Fisher goes...the word my older brother used to describe her was "horrified" ) and appealing new ones (Daisy Ridley is definitely going to be the first cinematic crush of a new generation of younglings). Some of the rumors are spot-on, others are full of crap, but judge for yourself whether or not they affect your enjoyment. There are niggling disappointments, but I'd much rather go back for seconds on this one than any of the prequels.

[Paul MacLean]

Haven't seen it yet, but reserved tickets for Sunday.

I got the CD today however.

It's got some fine music (and it's better than anything I've heard in a movie in some time) but I have to agree it's on the frenetic, strident side.

I miss the moments of nostalgic yearning in the previous scores (like "Binary Sunset" and "Watto's Deal / Kids at Play") and introspective moments (like "The High Council Meeting"). And there really aren't even any passages of epic grandeur (like "Yoda and the Force" and "Duel of the Fates"). And there's certainly no romantic passion going on here (despite one or two cursory references to the Han / Leia love theme). I'm assuming the film didn't furnish any such elements / moments on which Williams could comment.

But if cues like "Jango's Escape" and "General Grievous" are your thing, you'll probably like it!

[AndyDursin]

It's got some fine music (and it's better than anything I've heard in a movie in some time)

I concur with you Paul. I gave it another listen today and I can't think of a better score that I've heard in a long while. At the same time, it just doesn't measure up to its predecessors...and is just lacking a strong thematic line.

Nice notes by JJ Abrams though, I'm beginning to think he's legitimately sincere.

This is my last post before I see the film. We'll turn this over into a Spoiler discussion shortly!

[AndyDursin]

Well for all the hemming and hawing, I have to confess: I loved it.

Now, the more you think about it separated from the film, the more some of its flaws become apparent -- something I've found with Abrams' movies. However, it's been a long time since I came away exhilarated by a movie and this film did that...in spite of some issues.

I'll post my review later today but, in short, this "Star Wars Greatest Hits Remix" package is skillfully done and hugely entertaining. The Force is strong with this one -- though time will tell how effective its offspring will be, given the copious amounts of "previously released" content included within.

As for now -- so long as Disney brings in quality people to handle the writing and directing, the series will be in good hands. Goodbye AVATAR, there will be a far more deserving box-office champ in the very near future.

[AndyDursin]

My review is up on the front page:

http://andyfilm.com/2015/12/16/12-22-15 ... s-edition/

Some additional non spoiler thoughts that didn't make it into my review:

-Anyone else notice the tracked music from STAR WARS (Burning Homestead) in the climax at the end? Sounded like it was lifted right off it. Orchestra performance was different.

-Williams' score is not improved as a result of seeing the film. In fact I think I might have been disappointed even more by it. It's just too frenetic, bombastic, doesn't have any of the energy or thematic quality his prior scores had. It's still good -- but it is not in the same league as his Original Trilogy or prequel scores.

-Could have done without the Andy Serkis CGI character. Waste of time. Wasn't even that cool looking (and reminded me of something out of the prequels or LORD OF THE RINGS).

-Abrams' awkward writing crops up here and there ("we have to go back inside, we cant leave!"). The sort of thing that might overall bother you more in the days afterwards.

-Anyone else notice how even a scene where Carrie Fisher is talking to another character has multiple edits in it? LOL. I assume they must have had to "massage" all of her scenes, given the amount of cuts involved anytime she shows up. They also don't linger on her long either. Once she says something, they cut it short and move onto someone else.

-Nice move not trying to duplicate the 20th century Fox logo. It's not there, but at least they didn't try and come up with something else.

-Thought Oscar Issac was strong. Liked Ridley and Boyega a lot. Good casting, enthusiastic performances.

-A little too heavy on the Nazi imagery for my liking with the albino-white bad guys

-Loved the visuals. Blown away by how gorgeous this film looked to be honest. The set pieces, the use of locations (especially at the end), the cinematography was just dead-on. No Janusz Kaminski crap.

-The tone was right. Lots of humor. Abrams nailed the "lived in" universe aspect as well.

-I highly recommend people see it theatrically. People cheering at the beginning, going crazy at the end, applauding for Han Solo's introduction -- this is the kind of you thing you can't get at home.

Overall, I liked it a LOT, far more than any of the pre-fab franchises we've seen in years. I still have concerns going forward, but so long as Disney has quality writers and directors involved, The Force may be with them for some time to come.

[Eric Paddon]

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2015/12/ ... oes-crazy/

Linus: "Star Wars is not only getting too commercial, it's getting too dangerous!"

[Eric W.]

Thanks for the review and feedback Andy. (And others)

All told, it sounds like this is leaning in the "best case scenario" for this project given every concern we all have matched notes on for months around here.

[jkholm]

Saw it this afternoon with my 9-year old son, his first Star Wars movie in a theater! I really liked it, especially the new characters. I wish we could have seen more of Oscar Isaac although he was quite strong in his few scenes. My only major complaint on the first viewing was the third act's similarities to the first movie.

[AndyDursin]

That's awesome John! We're a few years away but I'm sure these movies will still be there when Theo is old enough.

I liked Isaac a lot also...hopefully well see more of him in the sequel.

[DavidBanner]

I will be seeing the movie at a DGA screening on Wednesday. Avoiding reviews before then so I don't get spoiled past the obvious bit about Harrison Ford. I'm still quite skeptical, but it's good to know the movie is popular with people who disliked the prequels. I still have to wonder what will happen with the director who inflicted Looper - that's really not a good sign to me for the future. If Abrams was such a good choice, why is he only doing the first movie and then essentially walking away? I realize he has a producer title for the other movies, but my experience tells me that the title can mean as little as giving a few cursory notes on the script and an early director's cut.

I also need to say that not everything in the prequels was a bad thing. Yes, there was the obvious kids' movie stuff with Jar Jar. Yes, the acting was mostly terrible. But I still found things to like in each movie - particularly the final one, which did a fairly good dovetail with the 1977 movie to tie things up. And at the same time, I had and continue to have issues with Return of the Jedi. When I saw it as a teenager, I cringed at the "Sister! So you have a twin sister!" dialogue, among many other missteps. In the years since, the movie has really shrunk - it's a sad statement that they had so much riding on it with the cliffhanger of Empire and simply couldn't do much to answer that. "From a certain point of view", indeed. (There's a part of me that wishes that Lucas had allowed Kershner to do the final movie himself - he could at least have found more human moments in the material than Richard Marquand did. Watching the movie last year, I had the impression that Marquand was more concerned with getting the movie done on time and on budget, as directly supervised by Lucas and Howard Kazanjian.)

I'll be curious to see how the story of this new movie lines up with how the original trilogy ended. In a simpler scenario, I could go with the idea that Abrams has simply opened up an alternate galaxy, just as he did with his attempts at Star Trek. (The oddest part of this has been the complete tossing of all the novels and other materials generated over the past 24 years. I always enjoyed the Zahn novels, and I remember them being huge bestsellers at the time they were released both in hardcover and paperback. I wonder how the sales might have gone if fans had been told that these books would be overridden a few years later and that the whole storyline would be relegated to something just north of fan fiction...)

[AndyDursin]

This film certainly looks and plays more like the original trilogy than the prequels on a number of levels. It definitely DOES feel "connected." How it looks, the humor involved. I have to hand it to Abrams, as I wrote in my review, he was on his best behavior with this movie and kept his own trademarks to a minimum. Unlike TREK, It doesn't play like "alternate universe STAR WARS," it actually feels LIKE the real thing, which is why I think people are responding to it so strongly.

And I didn't hate the prequels either -- but the one thing that always surprised me about them, in a negative way, was that Lucas didn't create any other characters whose storylines weren't "known" before it started. As someone who liked the first one, hated the second, really liked the third, I never found them to be an "upbeat escapist" experience which is what the original trilogy offered. We were stuck with Annakin, Padme and Obi-Wan for the entire duration of three movies, knowing it was going to end on a down note. Darth Maul was a cool character -- for 5 minutes in the first one. Liam Neeson's character exited the prequels as soon as he was introduced, etc. They were darker and not as appealing. Not as funny. And those are the elements that THE FORCE AWAKENS got right in my opinion. Not to mention THIS young cast is far more appealing than the likes of Hayden Christensen. You immediately feel right at home with Daisy Ridley, John Boyega and Oscar Isaac. Their enthusiasm and humor were pitch perfect. (Jury is out on Adam Driver but that's another issue...)

This film obviously has its share of flaws as I outlined in my review but the pleasures it generates outweighs the downs by a wide margin, And there's no endless discussion about politics, trade embargoes, and other convoluted plot elements that bogged down the prequels.

When I saw it as a teenager, I cringed at the "Sister! So you have a twin sister!" dialogue, among many other missteps. In the years since, the movie has really shrunk - it's a sad statement that they had so much riding on it with the cliffhanger of Empire and simply couldn't do much to answer that. "From a certain point of view", indeed.

I have similar issues with RETURN OF THE JEDI. It's the weakest, most static, of the three original trilogy films for me also. And it's not just about the Ewoks -- I remember seeing it in college with a friend of mine on laserdisc. After the opening bit on Tatooine, I remember him taking out a book and going "that's all the fun of this movie for the next 90 minutes." It really does DRAG. Marquand's pacing is sluggish, and once they get to Endor, it does feel like a grind before the film comes to an end.

The film's still good -- but unlike the two films that preceded it, it's not great.

[mkaroly]

I am happy to hear that people are enjoying the film; I will not be able to see it until January for a myriad of reasons, but maybe there is a chance I could see it sooner. We shall see!

I am glad to hear that it sounds like Abrams et. al. have attempted to infuse dimensionality into the human characters in the movie. I am definitely one who thinks that George Lucas is vastly overrated as a director and has made some extremely poor choices in his revisions of Episodes 4-6; in addition, he seemed to infuse more character into his CGI creatures than the people in his films which really bothered me. I complained in another thread about how poorly he handled Padme's character as an example in the prequels: she goes from one of the strongest characters (a very strong leader of a planet willing to fight for it) to a pregnant, crying, useless character - she deserved better (I cannot buy the fairy tale argument because he made her such a strong character in two of the three movies). I really liked Episode 3; Episode 1's best moments were with Darth Maul, and Episode 2 was garbage (the love story was poorly conceived, written, and acted out, especially by HC). My favorite of the series is Episode 5 with Episode 4 a close second. Episode 6's strongest moments were between Luke and Darth Vader...otherwise, the Ewoks (as was Jar-Jar Binks) are anathema to me! Lol!

So all that was in the back of my mind when the Disney machine started its overwhelming campaign to push this movie...now that my Lucas bashing is out of the way (lol) and the reviews are coming in as very positive, it seems like Abrams has elevated the series somewhat into what it could be in the hands of someone more capable. I am looking forward to seeing it.

I did get the score the other day - Abrams' liner notes were so incredibly generous that they bordered on inspirational. The music reminded me of the Zam the Assassin and General Grievous cues from Episode 2 and 3 (I think someone said that already in a previous post); it is decent music that has texture and dimension but I, like others in the thread, was wishing for new thematic motifs that were clear and stood out. The closest that Williams has come to writing "droning action music" is WOTW; this is not that. I think more than anything else it is a testament to how directors conceive of music in their films and what the industry expectation is today.

[AndyDursin]

As usual, the FSM board is like stepping into an alternate universe.

Some gems:

"Possibly the best Star Wars score since Jedi, I still maintain that. The leitmotif use is more sophisticated than it ever was in the prequels."

"Would you believe that I unusual skip over Duel of The Fates and Across The Stars when I listen to those scores? They are so self contained and standaloney that they seem like an interruption to the narrative flow of the albums. I'm fine with this new score not having something like this although I suppose that's what Rey's theme is meant to be. I like the overall kinetic quality to the score and don't miss the theme overload some may have been looking for."

"Everyone is harping on about the sound of the main title. To me it's closer in sound to the main title in the very first movie which is very bright and trumpet centric."

Just saw the film and relistened to the score and maybe due a nostalgic slant on my part, but I think this score is better than any of the prequel scores. While the prequels produced some musical themes of the Star Wars canon that can still be considered better than some other franchises, The Force Awakens brings it home again. To paraphrase a line by Han Solo.

What are these people listening to? It's like they are struggling to convince themselves of the quality of the score. Or saying the music is better because the movie is better -- two people claimed that also!

Of course I mention the tracked music from the end of the film -- NOBODY even talks about it other than one other guy.

[Paul MacLean]

Ok, here’s my 2 ¢…


…WITH SPOILERS…


…so don’t scroll down if you’ve not yet seen it…

















I thought it was good. Very good actually. I had concerns it might be “Star Wars: Into Darkness” but JJ Abrams exhibits far-greater fidelity to the Star Wars universe than he did to Star Trek's.

It was great too see Han Solo, Leia, Chewbacca, the droids and even Admiral Akbar again. The moment when we see that the “junk ship” is actually the Millennium Falcon was wonderful, and the idea to make Kylo Ren Han and Leia’s son was an interesting twist (and the fact that when he removed his helmet and revealed that he was not deformed or scarred was also refreshing and against expectations). Max Von Sydow’s cameo was cool (but I wish there had been more of him). I like the two new protagonists, particularly Finn (and John Boyega is a phenomenal new talent). I also appreciated that the clunkiness, cuteness and awkward moments which marred the prequels were missing from this film, and that it strove to recapture the tone of the original Star Wars, and The Empire Strikes Back.

However…there were also a lot of things that bugged me. Say what you like about the prequels — and they do have their problems — but at least they had original scripts. The Force Awakens just coasts on ideas from the previous movies — particularly Episode IV (Rebel hides plans in robot which is discovered by a young adult on a desert planet while being pursued by a villain with a black mask, helmet and cape who is part of a Nazi-like regime with a massive, planet-sized weapon that can destroy entire worlds). And they couldn’t even come up with any new types of planets, and just gave us Tatooine, Hoth and Naboo lookalikes? And the alien who runs the trading post on Tatooine — oops, I mean Jakku! — is basically Watto from Phantom Menace.

Why is a lightsaber now a “magical” artifact that can “call” people and give them visions? I guess because the filmmakers felt the need to keep up with LOTR and Harry Potter, so lightsabers are now imbued with a their own “life energy” like the One Ring, or horcruxes (is this any more silly than midichlorians?).

Luke Skywalker is now believed to be a “myth”? After only thirty years? You couldn’t erase the record of someone of that significance who had existed in living memory. There would be too many witnesses who are still alive. People would remember that the empire had been defeated, and the emperor assassinated — and by whom.

While I liked Rey and Finn, I was disappointed that their relationship wasn’t better developed. Everything was pointing towards a romantic payoff. But no, at the moment we assume they will kiss, they just exchange a friendly hug. And there is a strong inference than nothing is going to blossom between them in the sequels. Perhaps the filmmakers (and Disney) avoided a romantic angle because it would make Rey a somehow “weaker” female (in much the same way that Maleficent and Frozen distanced themselves from traditional romantic expectations as well). Or perhaps a love story was also considered too “heterocentric” for a film that strives to entertain audiences of all preferences. (And while on the subject why is Leia now “General Leia”? Is “Princess Leia” too sexist for today’s world?)

Finn is quickly defeated by Kylo Ren, leaving Rey to finish the job, during which she exhibits a stamina and fighting prowess which noticeably superior to that of an ex-stormtrooper. Hey, I believe women are equal, but this film kowtows a bit too much to the radical feminist perspective — the one which purports that women are superior to men. In any case, this lightsaber duel is also nowhere near as exciting or impressive as the one at the climax of The Phantom Menace.

All said and done, I did actually did like this movie, but I really don’t think it was better (or less flawed) than The Phantom Menace, and to my mind not as good as Revenge of the Sith.

As a film by a fan, and aimed at fans, The Force Awakens dispenses with a lot of the clunky flaws that people disliked about the prequels. But it replaces those flaws with flaws of its own. While it was unfailingly entertaining, it doesn’t take the story and characters anywhere new (whereas the prequels at least had very different storylines from episodes IV-VI). The Lucas films may have been criticized for being a “pastiche”, but at least they drew on much-respected (or at least much-loved) old-fashioned storytelling tropes (King Arthur, Kurosawa, Germanic myths, Flash Gordon, etc.). The Force Awakens just draws on Star Wars movies (and goes also a little overboard with the “I am woman, hear me roar” crap). It’s basically glorified fan fiction — some of the best I’ve encountered, but fan fiction nevertheless.